Author Topic: Bump Steer  (Read 8782 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline dsrace

  • VIP
  • *
  • Posts: 6090
  • my one true weakness
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #30 on: February 18, 2014, 04:57:43 PM »
I couldn't find a pic with tie rods on but we are talking about your current v8 build aren't we? is that set up as rear steer? just kinda looks like it in the pic I saw.
Don't never argue with an Idiot!
Because he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience

Offline fabr

  • Administrator
  • *
  • Posts: 91316
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #31 on: February 18, 2014, 05:13:49 PM »
I designed it so about 20 min's and i'll have it knocked out lol   whoo back up let me re-phrase that....depending on how many beers carl drank while putting it together 20 min's or so  rofl rofl

fabbr I did design in 5* anti dive ( apprx 5 *) to try on just my front end and either it wasn't enough or I simply can't tell the diff between my front ends w/o brakes nd this one since none of them really took a dive when I hit the brakes lol    but it does through a funny caster change in the mix which is tricky to adjust out and I can't get the toe in completely out using a full 24" of wheel stroke but now that it's all broke in ( I mean that litteraly after my near roll over in the front yard lol lol  that sent all 4 wheels off the ground and nearly blew two beads lol ) I have 1/4" toe in front full droop to full bump and If I cared to spend a little more time on it I am pretty sure I could cut that in half but it doesn't effect anything that I can notice yet.
Using the suspension analyzer I found antidive was a bitch to work with when dealing with long travel. Antidive also doesn't work without the brakes .
"There can be no divided allegiance here.  Any man who says he is an American,
but something else also, isn't an American at all.  We have room for but one
flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is
the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a
loyalty to the American people."
Theodore Roosevelt 1907

-----------------------------------------------------------
"I fear the day that technology will surpass our human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots" Albert Einstein  (IT'S OFFICIAL THAT DAY IS HERE NOW!)

Offline fabr

  • Administrator
  • *
  • Posts: 91316
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #32 on: February 18, 2014, 05:21:39 PM »
I set mine -.5 at full droop and achieve -3* full bump....no positive camber and I like the way it handles.  I did not set the rear up for a - camber arc but have been thinking about to see if it would do any better or not. I could make a new carrier to test this w/o changing the chassis side.
I meant negative ,just as you. I always get it bassackwards.  eyes brain fade I tell ya! Yes,the wheel tilts in at the top,never out. I setup my rear a arms to give a zero camber change over full travel but MAY add a bit of negative gain in bump for dirt use by making a different midboard mount.  Time will tell on that though. Not a concern at this time.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2014, 05:23:28 PM by fabr »
"There can be no divided allegiance here.  Any man who says he is an American,
but something else also, isn't an American at all.  We have room for but one
flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is
the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a
loyalty to the American people."
Theodore Roosevelt 1907

-----------------------------------------------------------
"I fear the day that technology will surpass our human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots" Albert Einstein  (IT'S OFFICIAL THAT DAY IS HERE NOW!)

Offline sandycrack

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 293
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #33 on: February 18, 2014, 07:36:14 PM »
got a pic?

Working tonight I'll take a couple tomorrow night and post.
You smell that?

Online Carlriddle

  • Another build? What are you thinking?
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 4455
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #34 on: February 19, 2014, 06:21:44 AM »
The absolute worse bump steer/toe POS I've ever seen was the car DS fixed for a guy not too long ago.  Pics on here of it.  It had more toe change than wheel travel.  Helen Keller could setup a front end better. 
« Last Edit: February 19, 2014, 09:20:54 AM by Carlriddle »
You can keep your CHANGE, I'd like to keep my DOLLAR.

Offline fabr

  • Administrator
  • *
  • Posts: 91316
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #35 on: February 19, 2014, 07:28:01 AM »
Carl,you might want to proof read that. It appears as tho you are saying that ds built the POS.  rofl LMAO He'll appreciate that.  ;D ;D  I think you meant the front end ds fixed for a guy,huh? 
"There can be no divided allegiance here.  Any man who says he is an American,
but something else also, isn't an American at all.  We have room for but one
flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is
the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a
loyalty to the American people."
Theodore Roosevelt 1907

-----------------------------------------------------------
"I fear the day that technology will surpass our human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots" Albert Einstein  (IT'S OFFICIAL THAT DAY IS HERE NOW!)

Offline sandycrack

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 293
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #36 on: February 19, 2014, 08:13:30 AM »
Now thats funny!
You smell that?

Offline dsrace

  • VIP
  • *
  • Posts: 6090
  • my one true weakness
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #37 on: February 19, 2014, 08:15:19 AM »
ya carl i repaired it i didn't build it  LMAO LMAO that pos was built at the buggy shop in hutch kansas and that guy doesn't know what the hell he is doing on front ends and should either get an education or quit!!  rofl

fabbr i know anti dive doesn't work with out front brakes but did forget to add that for the others that don't know. what are you thoughts on camber on rear?
Don't never argue with an Idiot!
Because he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience

Offline fabr

  • Administrator
  • *
  • Posts: 91316
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #38 on: February 19, 2014, 08:22:01 AM »
In sand ,I think zero camber is good. On hardpack or asphalt some castor is likely a good idea. It all depends on tire and grip.
"There can be no divided allegiance here.  Any man who says he is an American,
but something else also, isn't an American at all.  We have room for but one
flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is
the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a
loyalty to the American people."
Theodore Roosevelt 1907

-----------------------------------------------------------
"I fear the day that technology will surpass our human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots" Albert Einstein  (IT'S OFFICIAL THAT DAY IS HERE NOW!)

Offline fabr

  • Administrator
  • *
  • Posts: 91316
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #39 on: February 19, 2014, 08:30:03 AM »
Problem with adding negative caster to the rear is the loss of travel penalty.
"There can be no divided allegiance here.  Any man who says he is an American,
but something else also, isn't an American at all.  We have room for but one
flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is
the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a
loyalty to the American people."
Theodore Roosevelt 1907

-----------------------------------------------------------
"I fear the day that technology will surpass our human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots" Albert Einstein  (IT'S OFFICIAL THAT DAY IS HERE NOW!)

Offline sandycrack

  • Sr. Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 293
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #40 on: February 19, 2014, 12:34:25 PM »
So why camber on the rear?  My guess is added contact area in a turn?
You smell that?

Offline fabr

  • Administrator
  • *
  • Posts: 91316
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #41 on: February 19, 2014, 12:49:07 PM »
On a surface with grip camber will help with tire contact. In sand there is not enough grip to deflect the tire contact patch or so the theory goes. IMO,one thing is for sure ,you do not want positive camber on any surface. Most sand cars are looking to get max travel also ,so,-camber  is a no no from that standpoint .
"There can be no divided allegiance here.  Any man who says he is an American,
but something else also, isn't an American at all.  We have room for but one
flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is
the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a
loyalty to the American people."
Theodore Roosevelt 1907

-----------------------------------------------------------
"I fear the day that technology will surpass our human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots" Albert Einstein  (IT'S OFFICIAL THAT DAY IS HERE NOW!)

Online Carlriddle

  • Another build? What are you thinking?
  • Hero Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 4455
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #42 on: February 19, 2014, 01:07:45 PM »
Carl,you might want to proof read that. It appears as tho you are saying that ds built the POS.  rofl LMAO He'll appreciate that.  ;D ;D  I think you meant the front end ds fixed for a guy,huh? 

Boy I hacked that up!!  Too early for cold one (plus work) so I'm blaming it on not enough coffee.   ;D ;D
You can keep your CHANGE, I'd like to keep my DOLLAR.

Offline fabr

  • Administrator
  • *
  • Posts: 91316
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #43 on: February 19, 2014, 01:16:50 PM »
OK,since we're talking alignment,how about rear end toe in/out? I know my opinion is ,it depends on use also.
"There can be no divided allegiance here.  Any man who says he is an American,
but something else also, isn't an American at all.  We have room for but one
flag, the American flag... We have room for but one language here, and that is
the English language... and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a
loyalty to the American people."
Theodore Roosevelt 1907

-----------------------------------------------------------
"I fear the day that technology will surpass our human interaction. The world will have a generation of idiots" Albert Einstein  (IT'S OFFICIAL THAT DAY IS HERE NOW!)

Offline dsrace

  • VIP
  • *
  • Posts: 6090
  • my one true weakness
Re: Bump Steer
« Reply #44 on: February 19, 2014, 02:35:27 PM »
carl  rofl

sandycrack    for better traction at higher speeds like running on rails.

fabbr       as far as toe in the rear goes....i run 6 link rears as you know so there is  a small amount of slop soooo i measure the slop and split it and then set toe in half that amount which varies but minor. as close to parallel as poss.

fabbr what do you think camber would achieve on hard pack , sand or street? what about SAI on the rear carriers like kpi for contact patch on all 3 surfaces as well like a scrub radius contact patch on front? i wonder if that would load the tires in a way to cut and carve better?  just a thought.
Don't never argue with an Idiot!
Because he will drag you down to his level and beat you with experience