DTSFab.com (Desert, Trail and Sand)

UTV's Off Road ( RZR, YXZ, Mini Buggy, Carts,etc.) => UTV Member Project Logs => Topic started by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 03:25:42 PM

Title: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 03:25:42 PM
Well, The title says it all.  I really miss having a sandrail.  But I don't miss how wide my old car was.  So after a lot of thought, I went ahead and got plans to build an AR-51.  It is basically a modified and refined version of the piranha.  I sold by dirtbike last summer because it was killing my knees.  I guess with age, comes the cage.

Here is the start of the chassis.  I did most of my cutting and fab work on the chassis at work, on the weekends.

Here is the bottom portion of the chassis.  I love me an acorn table...
  (https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F008_zpsfjnv7zuq.jpg&hash=b197d12b769c31dc7e14d14229b3fd81) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/008_zpsfjnv7zuq.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F007_zpsw8vid5nt.jpg&hash=b1b9f3e302904bdf863c65379f5beae7) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/007_zpsw8vid5nt.jpg.html)

Once the base was tacked together, I tacked up the nose section.  Im pretty lucky to have a water jet available...

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F193_zpsdqsrsdbd.jpg&hash=9c195f8ce9a92bbb5e896c700fc20cfa) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/193_zpsdqsrsdbd.jpg.html)

Next up was the rear end.  It is made up of a few plates, and some tube....and lots of clamps holding it together.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F010_zpso3izuxsg.jpg&hash=f4ce1036f0853e1d589de4df8a8f6156) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/010_zpso3izuxsg.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F011_zpsf5d772de.jpg&hash=24e1ecdd0ccbf2ff81edbb782ed4a9ad) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/011_zpsf5d772de.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F012_zps7b6549c3.jpg&hash=70c0c52f0af92a3b320d24a7a39787ad) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/012_zps7b6549c3.jpg.html)



Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 03:30:47 PM
Once all tacked up, it was time to start making something that resembles a sand rail.

Just so happens, I had a table there just wide enough to build most of the chassis on..
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F014_zps24iaxism.jpg&hash=ec76fe92e66558181bc6e334928054aa) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/014_zps24iaxism.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F015_zpsmix21mhw.jpg&hash=958a7cdf4ff2f7e2cae116c54baa399f) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/015_zpsmix21mhw.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F194_zps7238456b.jpg&hash=33df9c85ec238b1123a3a397a2c73451) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/194_zps7238456b.jpg.html)

When I started the mid rails, out came the string line and the square.  It went together really well.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F016_zpsbtxdno50.jpg&hash=4ce34d0961412f164287a17ad9514565) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/016_zpsbtxdno50.jpg.html)


Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 03:35:20 PM
Well, after I got this far, I forgot to take pictures as the chassis was going together, and this was the outcome.  LOL

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F043_zpsb8ee1771.jpg&hash=b062974cf300f96c5b8f1a2da2a4d597) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/043_zpsb8ee1771.jpg.html)

Kinda looks like a UFO from the back.  LOL
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F040_zps7a94d58f.jpg&hash=611ff71c8108a2f2797afef01b20049b) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/040_zps7a94d58f.jpg.html)



(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F038_zpse6f08093.jpg&hash=53bf16f0ff6a61e45edef536ba052cc5) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/038_zpse6f08093.jpg.html)

Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 03:42:22 PM
From this point, I brought the chassis home, and it sat in the garage for a while.  In the meantime, I kept cutting plate work out, parts collecting ect.

I made up the jig plate for the arms and got them built as well.  The parts just fit how they were designed to fit.  Once I had all the arms built, I fit them to the car, along with the steering rack, and tie rods.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2FIMG_6357_zpsed340704.jpg&hash=c7fdd77c65c7b1b733313b3cae91fbde) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/IMG_6357_zpsed340704.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2FIMG_6354_zpsa9f2fb17.jpg&hash=d43ed94435ab624fc2c949fa2134e3a9) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/IMG_6354_zpsa9f2fb17.jpg.html)

Just a close-up of the welds on the rear uprights.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2FIMG_6355_zpse50d601a.jpg&hash=897cb15b1338785b33bf65b16874aee0) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/IMG_6355_zpse50d601a.jpg.html)

And a very loose mock up.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2FIMG_6349_zpsb4d24a01.jpg&hash=874539a3c240ea51638a1e816dbd8fe9) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/IMG_6349_zpsb4d24a01.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2FIMG_6351_zps4dcd8000.jpg&hash=042ddf7b840c79f8638e3e4ad7f8bf73) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/IMG_6351_zps4dcd8000.jpg.html)

Justin

Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 03:43:22 PM
MOAR PLATE!!

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150322_144854_zpsipwe0tph.jpg&hash=2b0e7183c11f72fef865f2e8a530c819) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150322_144854_zpsipwe0tph.jpg.html)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 03:48:19 PM
Next up, welding up the rear spool carrier.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_093901_zpsugqyhnqk.jpg&hash=517b4e587cb41e57605e9de6fb00e60e) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_093901_zpsugqyhnqk.jpg.html)

And some more mocking up.  Bolted on the rear caliper mount.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_100203_zpswij2ev43.jpg&hash=6f5a4eba18371e4f86e7190dab881050) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_100203_zpswij2ev43.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_100221_zpswk3jl5lo.jpg&hash=e6474b790732f59353353092a2b4ad03) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_100221_zpswk3jl5lo.jpg.html)

And a big ole rotor
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_100717_zpspjmawwoq.jpg&hash=416b4a776ff40c972c86fc61e76d4ff1) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_100717_zpspjmawwoq.jpg.html)

and a big ole sprocket
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_100750_zpsackpkwqc.jpg&hash=8c9a3f3685afc26d074a2f1b34a8b1fe) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_100750_zpsackpkwqc.jpg.html)

All bolted together, just to take it apart to fit it in place..  DOH!!
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_100750_zpsackpkwqc.jpg&hash=8c9a3f3685afc26d074a2f1b34a8b1fe) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_100750_zpsackpkwqc.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_134639_zpsb65i4ryg.jpg&hash=0636ada9e21a1bac7772a0a6393f26ff) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_134639_zpsb65i4ryg.jpg.html)

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 03:51:47 PM
The freaking brake was down at work, so I bent the sprocket and rotor skid plate old school style.

Laid out my lines, and cut the plate with a cut-off wheel, a bent the plate, and welded them up.  Worked grrrreat!

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_111811_zps1zeyh3ni.jpg&hash=5dc6aa091274797213eba056388b05cc) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_111811_zps1zeyh3ni.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_111553_zpsumvda0hw.jpg&hash=6d8a8edfd8368b2bfb57e750eb0e3998) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_111553_zpsumvda0hw.jpg.html)

A little test fit.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_112016_zpsis650qfj.jpg&hash=f54e2da66fe22092e3138bc068f2c827) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_112016_zpsis650qfj.jpg.html)

And smoked together.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_134832_zpscbftddv3.jpg&hash=f5eb3fbe12d4f9f9af18c1196bb003d2) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_134832_zpscbftddv3.jpg.html)

Justin


Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: beastybronco on May 30, 2015, 04:12:40 PM
Nice work but in the pic of  sprocket mounted it looks like a chain won't fit on right next to bulk head plate

But no doubt it's the view
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 05:17:39 PM
Nice work but in the pic of  sprocket mounted it looks like a chain won't fit on right next to bulk head plate

But no doubt it's the view

It does look that way, but there is plenty of clearance between the bulkhead and the sprocket.  Poopy picture.  I gotta hire a better photographer.  LOL
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 05:21:33 PM
The front hubs, and front uprights came from RickS.  Really nice TIG welds.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_101151_zps1voiy4i2.jpg&hash=3ba8a082af070bf95e8dcb74428c7afe) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_101151_zps1voiy4i2.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_101101_zpsubukslwa.jpg&hash=6ea35615763b9519b4a1ede80d75cd32)[/URL




 (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_101101_zpsubukslwa.jpg.html)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 05:23:21 PM
I really like how high in the chassis the radiator is.  And there really isn't anywhere else for it.  LOL  It has a good size oil cooler as well.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_100918_zpsuy3jvmer.jpg&hash=3fd0f11c7a525453fa912298d696f333) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_100918_zpsuy3jvmer.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_100946_zpslydxlcwm.jpg&hash=3279db1da873de3a1ea71ba10881cdf2) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_100946_zpslydxlcwm.jpg.html)

Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 05:25:48 PM
Here is a better shot of the sprocket clearance, and the rear a-arms.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_134624_zpsgrnhgxo3.jpg&hash=52772eb63a10b4a795861067326d06cf) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_134624_zpsgrnhgxo3.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_100932_zpsnljb1c3m.jpg&hash=0f15df76133404191e3796c2ea4d0d3b) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_100932_zpsnljb1c3m.jpg.html)

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 30, 2015, 05:37:37 PM
And a couple shots of the car as it sits.  Next week will will be fabricating the fuel cell, and the mounts for the tank.  Also, a few tabs for the rear skid plate.  I think after that, will be sheet metal and some paint.  As for a motor, I dint have one yet, but I am leaning toward a GSXR 1000, or an R-1. 

In the shock department, I think I will go with the King coil-overs with remote reservoir, with compression clickers.

What do yall think?

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_101126_zpsn68nm2jy.jpg&hash=5a826c78510af14f11f74e09b3caf9fd) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_101126_zpsn68nm2jy.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_165127_zps0lvge1k8.jpg&hash=80aabc1e7e4fd906e32d1f2d9f82a437) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_165127_zps0lvge1k8.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150530_165141_zpspushjcpt.jpg&hash=9b44fe1b63f312d91fdc328e3b590ab2) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150530_165141_zpspushjcpt.jpg.html)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fastcorvairs on May 30, 2015, 08:07:33 PM
Way to post a build thread deranged.  Love the build. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: WelderPat on May 31, 2015, 07:28:44 AM
Damn nice. I take it that you have done this before.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on May 31, 2015, 09:08:17 AM
nice work indeed! it always amazes me those little rack and pinnion's hold up cause they wouldn't in my rail. i've seen a number of them break at the dunes over the years.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 31, 2015, 11:19:59 AM
Way to post a build thread deranged.  Love the build.

Thanks!  This has been a fun build actually

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 31, 2015, 11:22:21 AM
Damn nice. I take it that you have done this before.

Thank you sir.  Yep, I built a Rorty R-16 back in 09/10.  I learned a lot on that build.  What I liked, and what I didn't like.  Here in Michigan, this new build will suit me very well.  Silver Lake is 1 hour from my house, and TONS of 2-tracks to hammer on.  The Rorty was just too wide.  That needed the desert.

Justib
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 31, 2015, 11:24:45 AM
nice work indeed! it always amazes me those little rack and pinnion's hold up cause they wouldn't in my rail. i've seen a number of them break at the dunes over the years.

DS, its actually pretty good size.  It's bigger than my rack in the Rorty car I had.  My son's mini proto die car has the baby rack to mine.  Ill post a pic later of the comparison.  This car will weigh in at about 900#'s 

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on May 31, 2015, 11:49:01 AM
it is just the pic,  900lbs is a good weight class
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on May 31, 2015, 11:56:33 AM
it is just the pic,  900lbs is a good weight class

Here is a pic of the rack, and the one in my son's car, and a yummy adult beverage bottle for reference.

 (https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150531_134703_zps1bs8pddn.jpg&hash=0f528c034cc970fe6a57090a14330302) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150531_134703_zps1bs8pddn.jpg.html)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on June 03, 2015, 08:07:40 PM
I mocked up my fuel cell tonight.  It is pretty tight, but it fits very well.  we had art and craft tonight with some poster board to fit things up.  Tomorrow, I will cut the real deal out of some 14 gauge stainless.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150603_202710_zpsbfj2rpgh.jpg&hash=1dc5fc47493a971aafe1cd3009df2e08) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150603_202710_zpsbfj2rpgh.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150603_202700_zpsf6qlyqce.jpg&hash=cd23738d4c119ab20d9e019757bf645c) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150603_202700_zpsf6qlyqce.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150603_202729_zpsld8olmtw.jpg&hash=2253fb1b2154e7b59d7456af2558ea51) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150603_202729_zpsld8olmtw.jpg.html)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on June 03, 2015, 08:39:16 PM
Well,I'm about a dyslexic moron. I had been ignoring this thread since I kept reading it as AR-15 not AR 51. I have little interest in reading about guns. Once I pulled my head out today, I see it's about a gun I truly like.  ;) ;) ;D ;D ;D ;D   Back to the topic though,I LIKE THIS BUILD!!!!!! VERY NICE WORK!!!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on June 04, 2015, 05:31:27 AM
So no chance of a gun section? I prefer to keep my stash a secret.

D has really flown thru this build, with some nice work!!  Are you running Ricks bearing assembly and fixed cv joints?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Yummi on June 04, 2015, 07:51:27 AM
No expert here.  But, maybe consider a shield / double wall on the under side of the tank?  That chain lets loose and it gets punctured?



I see it as AR 15 too.  To make Fabr's day, we are gonna quote a Rap superstar.  (He loves him some good rap.) 

"Got about fifty guns and I love all of them the same: Bang. Bang."
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on June 04, 2015, 07:57:51 AM
I'm by no means anti gun. I am a gun toting redneck though. Just not all ate up with the subject is all.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on June 04, 2015, 07:00:33 PM
Well,I'm about a dyslexic moron. I had been ignoring this thread since I kept reading it as AR-15 not AR 51. I have little interest in reading about guns. Once I pulled my head out today, I see it's about a gun I truly like.  ;) ;) ;D ;D ;D ;D   Back to the topic though,I LIKE THIS BUILD!!!!!! VERY NICE WORK!!!!

HAA!!  That's some funny $*%@!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on June 04, 2015, 07:04:46 PM
You are correct Yummi, there is provisions for a chain guard.

In this pic, you see the large hole for the fuel pump, to the left of that there is 2 tapped bungs kinda in-line with each other, that is where a formed chain guard will go, just in case.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150604_181118_zps1kcbakqm.jpg&hash=57c90ca632e40510150b4f12b455e3e9) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150604_181118_zps1kcbakqm.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150604_181128_zpsyomngvcw.jpg&hash=eeb23dd7cf94a5490134a0581a7d3803) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150604_181128_zpsyomngvcw.jpg.html)

I would say the fitment looks pretty darn close.  It should fit up nice to weld.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F20150604_181153_zpsyadlpvby.jpg&hash=580c5a63f1aa45d390be420198353f8f) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/20150604_181153_zpsyadlpvby.jpg.html)

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on August 26, 2015, 05:29:16 AM
NOTHING to show for the last 2 months.....  Ive been in Juarez Mexico, Elpaso, Nashville, and Cleveland on multiple projects.  BUT I almost have the coin for a nice shiny set of Kings...
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on November 08, 2015, 07:29:38 AM
So, I guess it's skid plate Sunday?
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F548_zpsrqfekx9f.jpg&hash=16dd127aebc5baf5e280741c69c09d0d) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/548_zpsrqfekx9f.jpg.html)

Between work projects I managed to get the skid plates built and in, some sheet metal on the sides, and doing dome CAD on the bonnet portion.  Here is one version

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F549_zpsmipqx9jr.jpg&hash=e89638fc6938e8e27df0b7d26ef51ea2) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/549_zpsmipqx9jr.jpg.html)

And here is the open version.  I am leaning toward the more covered up version.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F553_zpsknegwilo.jpg&hash=252ce7b468fb06630e2d31c74a43683b) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/553_zpsknegwilo.jpg.html)

And a pic from the driver seat.  It looks as if I will have pretty good vision with the full cover.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F555_zpsidccinhz.jpg&hash=e3f4c884a1cf1b73ffbfe11d09a5bbc0) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/555_zpsidccinhz.jpg.html)

Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on November 08, 2015, 07:33:25 AM
And a shiny new set of Kings for the rear! 
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F181_zps8gqweqmi.jpg&hash=d87b4dddc2ea1c40b150f1261e16cb32) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/181_zps8gqweqmi.jpg.html)

And I think this is a good spot for the resi.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F182_zpste3irbmr.jpg&hash=805bf518fe8b26d29717c62445031513) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/182_zpste3irbmr.jpg.html)

And for the front
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F184_zpsuma9odut.jpg&hash=2d0bdbeafa8abdcfd718df27ccbc3e85) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/184_zpsuma9odut.jpg.html)

And my favorite shot!
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F533_zpseaoevsdp.jpg&hash=eb5d71da1d65f99a4709e24d6415b198) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/533_zpseaoevsdp.jpg.html)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on November 08, 2015, 08:47:50 AM
You're getting closer to the test drive!!!!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on November 09, 2015, 03:41:41 PM
at this rate you'll be in full winter gear for the first trip to silver lake lol nice work
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: jersdunz on January 07, 2016, 12:53:29 PM
Oh dude, this one is looking terrible..
Better send it to me and start over'....... 5:
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on February 11, 2016, 10:53:25 AM
LoL!  Ill send it to you in pieces. 

Well, i managed to make it a roller!

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F088_zpszu7bzdzr.jpg&hash=30f46d0d960c8b8c91595bd036500cbb) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/088_zpszu7bzdzr.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F168_zps83j9gofc.jpg&hash=fc7ae86274ad26d5e380de440e7c0875) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/168_zps83j9gofc.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F169_zpsd9yzhplc.jpg&hash=192695f5ede918b3378c596e5bdb26af) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/169_zpsd9yzhplc.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F170_zpssenqbcyj.jpg&hash=09ddf73ed041ad4ad71eab68196d3e6a) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/170_zpssenqbcyj.jpg.html)

Time to save up for the front shocks, axles, micro stubs, and an engine.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: sandracer1 on February 11, 2016, 05:49:07 PM
Nice build. Those are some nice consistent welds.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on February 11, 2016, 06:09:12 PM
Sit that suckers ride height about 2 inches above full bump.limit travel to 5" total ,put some fat asphalt meats on it and it would make a bad ass looking road racer!!!!

Seriously,it's looking very good.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on February 12, 2016, 12:53:35 PM
Thanks guys.  Actually, I have my wheels off of my 300.  They are 22x9 in the front and 22x11's in the back.  Should look pretty cool with them on it.  And they are DOT approved for getting it road legal. 

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: jersdunz on May 10, 2016, 09:53:51 PM
Hey... Jose' anything getting done on this here buggy?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on October 03, 2016, 03:21:47 PM
STILL here!  LOL.  Been super busy lately. I did however pick up a complete...almost complete 03 GSXR 750.  I rode it around the block a couple times, and tore it apart. 
I am home for a week.  Just time enough to make engine mounts this week, and then off to South Korea for a week.
 (https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2F14264953_10207536000426176_2023105242505735166_n_zpsiuyofwgq.jpg&hash=5c6e30f66604cd040229bebacdfaaf1c) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/14264953_10207536000426176_2023105242505735166_n_zpsiuyofwgq.jpg.html)

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2FBike2_zpsbv4wa0qk.jpg&hash=f7ad62a17631f475c6c671bc2efdd6ed) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/Bike2_zpsbv4wa0qk.jpg.html)


(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi135.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fq124%2Fjterrell731%2FDiss_zpsmxpcn91d.jpg&hash=2686acb413e5571db65a4c9c86c54c6b) (http://s135.photobucket.com/user/jterrell731/media/Diss_zpsmxpcn91d.jpg.html)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on October 03, 2016, 08:03:02 PM
Cool!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on October 03, 2016, 08:42:23 PM
getting closer and nice work
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: big dave on October 04, 2016, 08:21:34 AM
Good looking build
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 10, 2017, 05:19:49 PM
Well here for my quarterly, errr, bi yearly update.  HA  Well, we have a little paint, a little assembly and no pictures tonight.  lol. 

I will post up some pictures tomorrow. 

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on April 10, 2017, 07:13:31 PM
Now you're just teasing us!  5: rofl rofl
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 11, 2017, 05:47:07 AM
Allllll righty.

Here is some shifty business..  Made up a simple bell-crank set up to bang-dem-gears, and a hand clutch.  My thought was to keep it on the left side. 
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fb61hdsm.jpg&hash=69e44d51aff8e538aa8bf7da1403077f)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FRCF4fsg.jpg&hash=63b46202c1667fe57b0b60635b62aa58)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FDAQGabv.jpg&hash=d2fce5a0bad69c4933d3fc215d6cba68)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FnKET1cJ.jpg&hash=857c77b171451abfeaa5d6aaef6547e7)

Believe it or not, the darn think actually worked!
Whipped up a heat shield to protect the seat.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FgKxRGEl.jpg&hash=05ab0ea2309ad55b675b10ae0a414beb)
Fit up some aluminum for the hood and dash piece.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FWBjfpLB.jpg&hash=6f9e53c8191081bf2588df498ea9d74f)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FrSbpk91.jpg&hash=2ae5abb2b336db575d34805510524362)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FoaBnrzv.jpg&hash=8e206d52ba319cb3160881ade7ffb7ac)
That was actually kinda relaxing doing the aluminum work.  It's pretty basic, but it turned out decent I think.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FdP3emIh.jpg&hash=5283c18723f99ab13bda7791a115d146)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FZuqOrmT.jpg&hash=afe5c9a68eb2fe981c4bc97bd63e22bb)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FtBx0E5x.jpg&hash=cc4b3ce5f48f13ee94169508ae1fcbcd)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fvzuam4f.jpg&hash=923a57714a74144e520a2816fbef1b07)

Al right, more i a litle bit.  I gotta do this thing called work to pay bills.  lol

Justin


Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on April 11, 2017, 06:10:24 AM
Good work!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on April 11, 2017, 09:57:33 AM
your getting closer!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 11, 2017, 10:47:52 AM
So this car is designed around air shocks.  However I wanted to go with the coilover and also the compression adjust.  Well, I had to modify the lower arms to accommodate the lower spring retainer.  Hind-sight, i should have re built the whole arm, but I think the modification is pretty stout.  I clearanced the inside of the arms, and added steel to fill things back in as well as plating the bottom of the arm.
Here is the arm upside down.
 (https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FA7WPFyb.jpg&hash=cfefd9e2356a16a1f8bc0642ed513fcd)

Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 11, 2017, 10:51:55 AM
So now time to take things apart to prep for powdercoat.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FoTgtlam.jpg&hash=d0147daa83b0899242e4587c4d808729)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FLFE91ek.jpg&hash=2d28c87bcbfdee9c22b8f0367678ad31)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FLngIs3x.jpg&hash=1fdb7696bcbf61173a30133952b8df18)

I went to Prismatic powders and got some textured black, and some gunmetal for the smaller items, and had the guys in the shop run them through the oven. It took a little time working around our production schedule, but the labor was free.  I slid him $100 though
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FHdIMja5.jpg&hash=ffc2f4675dc531bb62888ac82572dbb3)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FtMOgvI8.jpg&hash=a3d3f33829aa14dc8a9c8154a6c98ee0)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FvYW0DOA.jpg&hash=c18d32c2dcfb7a8d74ad63b53d9a19d4)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 11, 2017, 10:55:55 AM
So, I went with a dark cherry metallic for the main chassis.  It is a 2 stage powder.  Base goes down, cure to a gel, spray the clear and do a full bake.  Turned out KILLER!
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FnYoU4pA.jpg&hash=17bc881df47c3781703b91cf7cf91c1d)
Partial cure
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FnTT7JZc.jpg&hash=eacd58a844fbd6428a3fd33e47962e4d)
AAAANNNDDD the cocaine over the stripper glitter.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FgrffK1c.jpg&hash=49ab997f621eb13f4bb85bc610fe0955)

And a fully coated chassis ready for assembly. 
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FhEymUjc.jpg&hash=042889d79cb722a6f557f26e83fb00e9)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FJ3Du8D5.jpg&hash=0f780d50bc416b341d8ae5cf2d70dead)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 11, 2017, 11:00:50 AM
Iv'e had this together and apart so many times that I know the assembly will go good.  But it takes a lot longer not banging things around, and thread locking everything.  Here is what I have so far!  Now I have to do all the wiring, plumbing, and button everything up.  More to come!
 giggity
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FD4SHZCL.jpg&hash=eac1a5d7396fcbca3e24425c4f49cd7b)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F0Y3Hu3W.jpg&hash=3fff08461ddf39d8c7ed4bb57c1d817b)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FTEgfzyt.jpg&hash=cb490345483aa52a8e2cbcc2084e1a39)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FLs5kJF8.jpg&hash=077f49cc4a989faa9310bf16fcee67fb)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FnznSCIo.jpg&hash=e6d6ee92ecc139bdcb6066830a275abb)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FyuzaEab.jpg&hash=bfc3f90580c5115fb83bcd3d3972729b)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FXnI8jES.jpg&hash=1c4d58ec53e2a80c0cded3466848a18e)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FGuIzcxo.jpg&hash=1c6d71c3006d5a5742f81e7289602565)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FAp3TkM9.jpg&hash=4fb4b2b336a6133995697ee5dbcfe418)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fkds6GKD.jpg&hash=df8cf24923e40b990584c663ff449f20)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F9gJlv0M.jpg&hash=de4419f79ab51c1d475fd8b02245ac61)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on April 11, 2017, 01:08:05 PM
SWEET!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 11, 2017, 01:44:19 PM
Thank you sir!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: big dave on April 11, 2017, 03:37:32 PM
VERY NICE WORK.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Enemy on April 11, 2017, 03:47:40 PM
Hot damn! That is looking Awesome!
Nice work!!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 17, 2017, 05:01:31 AM
Thanks fellas!  This weekend I got it 95% wired.  I have to tie in the horn, front blinkers, and headlights.  BUT  I did get it running yesterday too!!  I knew the bike ran when I took it apart, but after all the care taken in soldering all the connections and lengthening all the wires it sure does feel good.  Next up is the plumbing, axles, and cables.  Oh yeah, bleed the brakes. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on April 17, 2017, 06:01:54 AM
You're just a heart beat away from having fun now!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 18, 2017, 04:14:11 AM
So close, yet so far away.  I am headed out of town for 3 weeks to a jobsite at Pratt & Whitney. 

Well, here are some MOAR assembly pics 
The bottom of the electrical box, and the battery tray. 
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FC3DvtRq.jpg&hash=9dd0b4cfa685bf0f0e72d69b60bddaca)
This is the front of the battery tray where the ECU is mounted, as well as the kickstand switch, and I believe an air density sensor of some sort.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FlAktU4w.jpg&hash=2c9b3c27925437f4ba2b9bc3f6073952)

And after a day of wire harness extension, and installation. 
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FAqxhMKr.jpg&hash=361c041fedee63cae25c480c262e45ce)

in all reality, these GSXR harnesses are pretty simple and easy to modify to fit the cars.  All splices were soldered, and shrink wrapped.  Super clean, and IMO the right way to do it.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F4rHz8pP.jpg&hash=05d3e50f7e5ff622b3ecc026cd6fd1bb)
And back on all 4's with the body panels on.  One thing I want to do is re-think my coil springs.  I think I want to go with a lighter coil on both the front and the back of the car.  It seems like it's too much into the droop.  When I ordered the springs from King, I wanted to be 40-60.  It seems more like 20-80.  I will have to get it out and run it first.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FXcPKDIY.jpg&hash=1aa3dc6e1922eaf352af97420419467f)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FrlD0dos.jpg&hash=9f9605f7926d724b86bb9bb9b42a5fec)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FlahQAJ7.jpg&hash=65474ccd3b389a1dfb7c9d6012285727)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FfXSm7FT.jpg&hash=d8dd62b4eff907ffa0097610882fd613)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on April 18, 2017, 06:05:09 AM
The talent our members have is truly impressive.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fastcorvairs on April 18, 2017, 09:29:08 AM
I can see a lot of talent in this build.  Not to many people have enough pride in there self or work for this caliber of work.  I can see pride dripping off this build.  Keep up the excellent work Deranged. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on June 05, 2017, 05:48:14 AM
Hey fellas!  Still here.  LOL  So, I got all my cables last week, installed my chain and finally took it out.  This car handles SOO much better than my old Rorty car.  Very nimble.  The 750 seems to pull it really nice too.  So far, everywhere I have driven it (fields, grass, gravel roads) I can nail it, and loose traction rather quick.  Cornering is a matter of blipping the throttle point and shoot.  I will still have to re valve to a lighter shim stack, as I am already adjusted out to the softest setting.  When I re valve I will probably do a flutter stack to take up some of the choppiness.

Also, the GSXR 1000 countershaft sprocket is the same as the 750, so bought a 13 tooth for the front, while the rear is a 60 tooth, with 28" tall tires.  Seems really peppy with this gearing. 

Here is a link to literally my first spin.  HAA  It's hard to steer, hand clutch, hand shift while doing a live facebook video.
  https://www.facebook.com/justin.terrell.31/videos/10209717568164006/
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on June 05, 2017, 09:33:23 AM
Oh yeah, I have a shut down at a plant in Farmington MO over the 4th.  This is 10 min south of St. Joe State Park.  Has anyone been there before?  I will have just enough room for my car on the back of the flatbed I am hauling down there.  SOOOO, after the shutdown, i'm gonna have a little fun. 

Anyone been there?  Tips?  Will I need some sort of ORV sticker or a flag?

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on June 05, 2017, 05:20:41 PM
really cool to see your project going from a concept to fruition . You should feel a real sense of accomplishment!  dd:  I've not been to St.Joe but from what I've been told you should have a great time there with a buggy of your size. Please post some pics,your impressions of the place and maybe a vid.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on June 06, 2017, 05:19:20 AM
That's where the redline revolt guys play,  Hopfully he'll chime in w tips........
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on June 08, 2017, 05:11:42 AM
I will definitely give a report. From what I gather i don't need a flag like at silver lake, but I will bring it just in case. 

ALSO, there is an event on July 8th at Valley Motocross track in Stanton Michigan with the Dirt Alliance guys, and I was invited to run there!  They are having a hard time finding SXS's with actual cages, fire extinguishers, and 5 pt harnesses to run there.  Well, i'm all over that. 

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on August 03, 2017, 05:29:14 AM
Well, now that the AR-51 is up and fully operational I will start posting pics and videos here!

I loaded up the ole girl on my work trailer as we were doing a job down in Farmington MO which is 10 min from st Joe state park. That was a lot of fun. This car on the trails is a riot! Nimble, and very controllable with a little throttle application. The 750 does really nice in the trails. It seems to like it between 6, and 10k RPM. The ambient air temp was maybe 90, and the car ran at 190, and touching on 200 when I was really hammering down. Unfortunately I didn't have the gopro with me. I did get it up to 70 on the flats with another gear to go. When I hit some wet sand, it dug in, and you really could feel it lurch forward.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F1XjeM9x.jpg&hash=01f7beba83326d1f24f45092d43f5cb4)
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FgHgOOnA.jpg&hash=a640ad0fb489fbb6b4521855d542e59d)
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Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on August 03, 2017, 05:47:32 AM
Always great to hear of a satisfied builder!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on August 03, 2017, 09:32:46 AM
sandracer1 runs that park....wonder where he went off too
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on August 03, 2017, 09:33:22 AM
nice work btw.......what the sprocet ratio,
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on August 03, 2017, 01:51:19 PM
Thanks fellas! 
I actually found out that a GSXR 1000 countershaft sprocket is splined the same as the 750.  So I have a 13 tooth in the front and the rear is a 60 tooth.  The tires are 28" tall. 
Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on August 03, 2017, 01:56:16 PM
BUT WAIT!  THERE'S MOAR!

Well, a couple weeks ago I was FINALLY able to head up to Silver Lake Sand Dunes. Literally 1 hour and 15 min from by driveway. I haven't finished my wheel adapters for my beadlocks so I mounted the paddles onto my normal wheels. This thing looks KILLER with paddles, and ribs up front!! I really wasn't nervous at all hitting the dunes either. The test drives before have proves this car out. Lot's of people were checking it out and wondering who makes them. LOL I think I may have increased Ricks web site traffic. I had the rears aired down to 7 psi, and the front at 9 psi and the paddles work awesome!! Once I get the beadlocks on I will go a little lower on the pressure as I get a fair amount of wheel spin in the dry sand. If the sand is wet, I could actually go up in PSI as it bogs down a little unless i'm really up in the RPM. I actually hit a nice roller and wheelied off the back of it!!! The feeling of that rivaled the first time having sex!!! HAHAHAA!!

The 750 pulls really nice in the sand. This car is SO much more fun than my old Rorty car. That car just needed an enfine with more torque, bypasses, and suspension seats. Oh yeah, if you are building a car definitely go with a suspension seat! I could lounge in the car all day long! I ordered up a set of shims one step lighter, and a flutter stack to take out some of the chop.

Going over the woops felt good, but choppy. But the harder I hit a certain section, the car seemed to hit the tops and smoothed out some. When I let off the gas, that is when the back would pogo a little. Still needs to be softer to get my adjusters more in the middle of the compression adjustment. Hitting some small jumps, the car actually didn't nose dive! In fact the front landed after the rear wheels. I think my rebound may actually be set up right!
I added a heat shield to the heat shield too.  I used this stuff called Boom-Mat.  It has a thin aluminum shell, some insulation and some really sticky stuff too.  It also kinda keeps some small vibrations down from the aluminum panel.
(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FEhrCtH6.jpg&hash=05bf193c9f5238dbf1bd973498d00abb)

Some action shots!
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Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on August 03, 2017, 03:05:26 PM
very nice looking color! sort of matches your truck too. must be balanced very well to be landing rear first as a mid engine! 4.62 ?1 ratio with 28" paddles is a pretty good combo. i used to run the 4.92 ration on the blaster 26 paddle in 800 to 850 lb rails with 1000 cc engines. with the 1100 paddles you'd want to be closer to the 5.25/1 or deeper. that 750 prob has a little more tq closer to idle than the 4 cyl 1000's but they all like rpm. are you running an oil cooler? if not looks like there's room for an 8" fan behind the seat.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on August 04, 2017, 05:29:31 AM
I have an oil cooler that actually mounts in front of the radiator, but I took it out for more air flow to the radiator.  I may remote mount it with a fan.  It wouldn't hurt to do that at all.  Yeah, I drive it like a 2 stroke dirt bike.  LOL.

Right now I'm dealing with a possible fuel issue.  It falls on it's face on WOT.  I have a couple areas to look at. 
1, My fuel neck gasket was the wrong material, so there may be some junk in the screen.
2, I will find the dealer plug, jump the 2 wires needed to see any codes on the dash.  The most common one is the secondary TPS.  The main TPS and the secondary TPS are adjustable for some odd reason so if it either one is out of adjustment it will have a condition just as i'm experiencing.  I have the shocks off to re valve, the tank almost out, a trailer to build, a camper to get ready for vacation, just fixed a jeep frame from the Michigan rust.  So yeah, there just ins't enough hours in a day.  Maybe I should do some coke and just stay up for a week to get everything done.  HAA!
Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on August 04, 2017, 06:00:19 AM
TPS adjustable set by voltage?  Wonder if ya running outta fuel, from pump or clogged filter.  CAr looks great, always a few bugs to work out.  Does that motor have secondary inj in air box?  I have ran a Bazzaz FI control with auto tune last two engines.  Reads afr thru wideband O2 sensor, and will data log thru rpm/gear.  And adjust fuel map with laptop.  Also will read TPS voltage.  Very slick, easy to use and really wakes up engine, smoothes acceleration.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on August 04, 2017, 12:06:49 PM
I have an oil cooler that actually mounts in front of the radiator, but I took it out for more air flow to the radiator.  I may remote mount it with a fan.  It wouldn't hurt to do that at all.  Yeah, I drive it like a 2 stroke dirt bike.  LOL.

Right now I'm dealing with a possible fuel issue.  It falls on it's face on WOT.  I have a couple areas to look at. 
1, My fuel neck gasket was the wrong material, so there may be some junk in the screen.
2, I will find the dealer plug, jump the 2 wires needed to see any codes on the dash.  The most common one is the secondary TPS.  The main TPS and the secondary TPS are adjustable for some odd reason so if it either one is out of adjustment it will have a condition just as i'm experiencing.  I have the shocks off to re valve, the tank almost out, a trailer to build, a camper to get ready for vacation, just fixed a jeep frame from the Michigan rust.  So yeah, there just ins't enough hours in a day.  Maybe I should do some coke and just stay up for a week to get everything done.  HAA!
Justin

i know exactly what you mean there! carl is right the bazzaz is a very nice and extremely easy way to adjust/tune your engine for it's current config and the loads your now putting to it.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on August 07, 2017, 05:34:03 AM
Those Bazzaz set ups are KILLER!  The only issue is me engine is an 03, and Bazzaz starts the GSXR's at 05.  DOH!!  I do like how they use the wideband to adjust fuel. Thanks for the info for sure.  If I get a newer engine some day one of those will be put in.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on August 07, 2017, 05:42:08 AM
So one of my trips to Silver, I kinda sent it...  I definetly got some frequent flyer miles on this.  Here is the montage of pictures that Bill Loomis with Sandflix.com shot.  I thought I broke something because I have never sat in the car at full bump to see where the tires were in reference to the chassis.  That was pretty crazy.  I had a little whiplash for a day or so.

(https://dtsfab.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FFBHzKj9.jpg&hash=12e1ec62f862d066f2253db834db5ee3)
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Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on August 07, 2017, 06:12:31 AM
Those Bazzaz set ups are KILLER!  The only issue is me engine is an 03, and Bazzaz starts the GSXR's at 05.  DOH!!  I do like how they use the wideband to adjust fuel. Thanks for the info for sure.  If I get a newer engine some day one of those will be put in.

Justin
No worries.  They never made on for a zx-12, but I have one. LOL  I used one from a zx-10, several yrs later, as same inj plgs and sensor plugs.  Had comp tech at Bazzaz reprogram comp to read the crank trigger as the 12 used something no other bike did.  No charge!  They are super helpful.  Comp are all the same, most harness are too, just diff length of wires to sensors.  Load any bike map into any comp, and off ya go to data loggin a map for your motor. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on August 07, 2017, 06:50:29 AM
they didn't make a system for my 2001 hayabusa either but 02 and up. so all i had to do was swap out fly wheel and ecu to 02 to 07 and i was good to go. didn't even have to change the harness on mine. the newer ecu's have better and faster processors.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on August 07, 2017, 06:51:25 AM
very nice pics btw......is the photographer a friend of yours?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on August 07, 2017, 07:30:03 AM
I will have to contact Bazzaz on this!  Thanks for the info guys!!

Bill Loomis is up at Silver Lake taking photos every weekend.  He sells them inside B&L Motorsports.  Great guy to deal with.  He takes thousands of photos, posts them up on his website and you can purchase them.  Lots of cool pictures on his site. 

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 04, 2017, 12:11:03 PM
Went out this past weekend.  My fuel issue was still there which sucked, as I cleaned the whole system out or so I thought.  More on that later.  I did however re valve my main compression stack.  I went from a 12 to a 10 stack and kept the 12 flutter stack in there.  WOW!  WAY better!!  I still have to drop down a shim stack size in the compression clicker piston to dial it in even more.  I will be taking the 12 stack and putting that into the front, which has a 15 in it now.  The rear I think needs lighter springs.  I have 300's on the bottom, and 250's on top.  With me in the car it has a total of 2-1/4" of bump out of 12".  Should have more like 3-4".  When I re valve the front i'm going to take the 200 off the front, drop the 250 in the rear to the bottom, and put the 200 from the front on top of the 250, re measure to see where it's at.  It takes time, but when you feel the results it is awesome!  I am making a spreadsheet of my changes and taking notes as I go. 

Now my fuel system.  Last night I took out my injectors, got a 12" piece of 3/8" fuel line clamped it to the inlet of the injector, filled it up with carb cleaner, took my air hose at 40 PSI and stuck it on the hose.  I used a 12v battery to rapidly fire the injectors to clean them out and to see the spray pattern.  All was good there.  Next up was the pump.  I completely took it apart this time.  Pulled the screen to really clean it good.  Also the plastic "body" that the pump goes into is actually a filter.  I thought it was a "manifold" of sorts for the pump, level sender and the fuel pressure regulator.  I went ahead and started hitting it with carb cleaner....HOLY MUD!  Just packed full of black crap!  I went through 2 cans of cleaner.  Soaked, tapped to dislodge any crap, soaked some more and back flushed with air until it was clean.

I put it all back together this morning and took it for a spin.  Instantly I noticed crisper throttle response, and yep, she gets it now!!  Better than it ever was!  YES!!!  On a side note, paddles razors, wet grass makes for an interesting cornering experience!!HAHAHAHA   I weaved through some pine trees the front turned, the rear wanted to come around and almost hit the tree.  I pinned it at the last second and pulled out if it.  LOL

Here is a video of the rear suspension working. 
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqGgMGFA9PU&t=18s

And here is a video of the front suspension working.  At 1:10 ish, i pulled a little wheelie!!!  Wish I had full throttle there. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1ouXYzsm5s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1ouXYzsm5s)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 04, 2017, 12:57:11 PM
Went out this past weekend.  My fuel issue was still there which sucked, as I cleaned the whole system out or so I thought.  More on that later.  I did however re valve my main compression stack.  I went from a 12 to a 10 stack and kept the 12 flutter stack in there.  WOW!  WAY better!!  I still have to drop down a shim stack size in the compression clicker piston to dial it in even more.  I will be taking the 12 stack and putting that into the front, which has a 15 in it now.  The rear I think needs lighter springs.  I have 300's on the bottom, and 250's on top.  With me in the car it has a total of 2-1/4" of bump out of 12".  Should have more like 3-4".  When I re valve the front i'm going to take the 200 off the front, drop the 250 in the rear to the bottom, and put the 200 from the front on top of the 250, re measure to see where it's at.  It takes time, but when you feel the results it is awesome!  I am making a spreadsheet of my changes and taking notes as I go.  Perfect!!!

Now my fuel system.  Last night I took out my injectors, got a 12" piece of 3/8" fuel line clamped it to the inlet of the injector, filled it up with carb cleaner, took my air hose at 40 PSI and stuck it on the hose.  I used a 12v battery to rapidly fire the injectors to clean them out and to see the spray pattern.  All was good there.  Next up was the pump.  I completely took it apart this time.  Pulled the screen to really clean it good.  Also the plastic "body" that the pump goes into is actually a filter.  I thought it was a "manifold" of sorts for the pump, level sender and the fuel pressure regulator.  I went ahead and started hitting it with carb cleaner....HOLY MUD!  Just packed full of black crap!  I went through 2 cans of cleaner.  Soaked, tapped to dislodge any crap, soaked some more and back flushed with air until it was clean.

I put it all back together this morning and took it for a spin.  Instantly I noticed crisper throttle response, and yep, she gets it now!!  Better than it ever was!  YES!!!  On a side note, paddles razors, wet grass makes for an interesting cornering experience!!HAHAHAHA   I weaved through some pine trees the front turned, the rear wanted to come around and almost hit the tree.  I pinned it at the last second and pulled out if it.  LOL

Here is a video of the rear suspension working. 
 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KqGgMGFA9PU&t=18s

And here is a video of the front suspension working.  At 1:10 ish, i pulled a little wheelie!!!  Wish I had full throttle there. 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1ouXYzsm5s (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y1ouXYzsm5s)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 04, 2017, 01:14:38 PM
Cool vids! Thanks for sharing. Looks like you were having a good time. You might want to go a bit lighter rebound valving on the fronts.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 04, 2017, 01:30:34 PM
looks like a good day on the sand.....well other than the 4x4 meet and greet lol

i think it's time you run on down to LS dunes with us and your neighbor douggy heim
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 04, 2017, 04:46:42 PM
I agree!!! I'm quite sure from what I saw ,deranged's car would be a lot of fun and quite capable. Of course,once he visited he'd never be able to look at his dunes the same ever again. They'd have disappointment written all over them. ii: YES,come on down and enjoy your next step learning duning before we get you to St.A.  The time has come!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 04, 2017, 07:25:35 PM
+1
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 05, 2017, 07:29:07 AM
When is the LS trip?  That sounds like fun!  Yeah, it would make our sand box look like a litter box, but it's only an hour away. 

As for the front, I need to soften the compression up a tad first, then see what the rebound needs, but i agree, the rebound feels a little slow.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 05, 2017, 10:29:40 AM
10/1-10/7. Basically ride days of 2-6.  Get your plans made soon. I think the state sites are booked up . There are still be some spots at Dueces Wild RV .Water and electric hook ups. No with sewer left. There is a dump station on site though and showers/restrooms.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 05, 2017, 03:02:17 PM
yep dueces is all the left on the north side.....ya know i didn't check that site at the gate...golden sands?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 06, 2017, 02:05:05 PM
Well crap!  I have several meetings with Boeing that week for a project we are doing for them.  Next time for sure!!

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 06, 2017, 04:41:35 PM
Well,they can just reschedule!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 09, 2017, 08:47:40 AM
HA  Easier said than done.  It is almost impossible to get all of their people involved with the project together at the same time. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 10, 2017, 12:35:18 PM
Took the ole girl out to the dunes yesterday.  And wow, now that I have a clean fuel system and am able to hit full throttle this car RIPS!!!  From 8-14k RPM it just pulls and pulls!  Stoked!!

I re valved the front to a lighter compression stack and it soaks up everything.  While re valving I took the 200# coils off the front and put them on top of the 250# coils in the rear, (200 top and 250 lower) and I think that is still to stiff, as that gave me almost 3" of bump with me in it.  This over-spring is very clear now that the front is soaking things up.  I will have to do some spring calculating this week and get some lighter coils coming.  My gut is thinking 200 and 150? 

Last night all of my pre runner buddys were there for a night run, as the it was the last day the dunes were open until 10pm.  THAT was fun.  Just  hammer down, as there was no one else out there.  Very odd to hit a roller and jump it and not see your landing.  LOL 

Justin 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 10, 2017, 05:18:32 PM
Took the ole girl out to the dunes yesterday.  And wow, now that I have a clean fuel system and am able to hit full throttle this car RIPS!!!  From 8-14k RPM it just pulls and pulls!  Stoked!!

I re valved the front to a lighter compression stack and it soaks up everything.  While re valving I took the 200# coils off the front and put them on top of the 250# coils in the rear, (200 top and 250 lower) and I think that is still to stiff, as that gave me almost 3" of bump with me in it.  This over-spring is very clear now that the front is soaking things up.  I will have to do some spring calculating this week and get some lighter coils coming.  My gut is thinking 200 and 150? 

Last night all of my pre runner buddys were there for a night run, as the it was the last day the dunes were open until 10pm.  THAT was fun.  Just  hammer down, as there was no one else out there.  Very odd to hit a roller and jump it and not see your landing.  LOL 

Justin
LMAO LMAO LMAO LMAO rofl rofl rofl rofl
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on November 01, 2017, 04:55:54 AM
So, I have been at the dunes multiple times in the past couple months and the car just feels amazing in the dunes!  The ONLY thing is the lack of torque to pull the wheels on the back of a roller at will.  I can hit it just right, and pull the front wheels which is still cool. 
I am getting better and better at jumping and proper throttle application just before takeoff.  I have had a couple small nose-dives but that was a crappy approach. 

A couple weeks ago I met a couple friends up there on a Friday with very few people there....Yeah, the guy with the 2 seat Tatum car with the Lowrance GPS had us going 99 MPH in one area!! Stupid......stupid fun.  LOL.

Now that dune season is done, there is one area that I need to address. The inner pivot for the rack is a ball and socket.  Well the socket has some play.  I do not want this to become an issue for obvious reasons.  I will simply cut that off and weld on a clevis and use a heim joint for the inner pivot.

The latest trip was pretty cool.  The wind was strong out of the south, so all of the southbound hills had nasty lips, but the top of the hills were flat.  Perfect little kickers for a short wheelbase car!!

Well here is some buggy porn.
(https://i.imgur.com/7gb9Zq2.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/dHqXcJI.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/i7ncZ4Q.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/t0C6x3y.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/OOkPxht.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/lzGXBOO.mp4)
(https://i.imgur.com/93jTIdB.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/U79TQI9.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/pkfiZYo.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Xht7tiA.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/uHOQYyW.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/l0Q6uv9.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/NwghqEl.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on November 05, 2017, 07:36:52 AM
very nice pics and looks like a blast. i will never understand why the flags are  on the front nose in your line of sight when that place is directional...... i mean the guy your going to rearend at the top will never see the flag???????
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on November 05, 2017, 07:38:52 AM
i really like that f9 funco
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on November 05, 2017, 08:31:31 AM
I think deranged needs a pilots license.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 03, 2017, 07:01:22 AM
It seemed like this forum was down forever! 

Yeah that F9 car is sooopid fast.  And yeah, I love jumping this thing!!!  Well now that it is winter here in the mitten state, I have the car all tucked away for winter. 
My plans for the spring are a new PRP seat, CV prep, new coils in the rear to get the proper spring-rate a wrap and a steering rack upgrade.  it is actually a good feeling to have just little upgrades to do and have a turn-key car ready for next year.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 03, 2017, 07:03:20 AM
AAAANd with my new seat, I had to do something productive with my old seat.  LOL

(https://i.imgur.com/wcgu0RK.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 03, 2017, 08:59:59 AM
i really like the office chair  ;) ;) pretty good idea but what was wrong with that seat?

btw i will never understand the flags on the front of the toys! lol i cannot see an advantage to that opposed to on the roofs or cages.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 03, 2017, 09:05:03 AM
i use the beard r&t seats with adjustable head rests. i had new covers made for mine and 2" extra dense padding added. i like then as seats like you new office chair push in on my shoulders a bit and it really bugs me. the r&t seats don't follow up that high so a better fit on the same note they don't hold you quite as well up top, but i pre fer the comfort.
(https://s33.postimg.org/7zqxqx0fv/00a.jpg) (https://postimg.org/image/7zqxqx0fv/)

only pic i have on hand but you can see what i'm talking about.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 04, 2017, 04:46:02 AM
There really isn't anything wrong with it.  I am getting a "custom" PRP seat.  It will kinda match my car somewhat.  After sitting in my new office chair, I know what you are saying about the back pressure.  If I put my legs out like i'm sitting in my car it feels better.  Hmm.
As for the Silver Lake flags they actually do help in some areas.  I would say that 1/3 of the dunes are directional so they don't do much, but on the free for all area they do come in handy, especially when cresting a hill.  Honestly, it would be better on the roof or off the cage.  It would be higher and more visible.   

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 18, 2018, 09:42:53 AM
Well,
It's been a busy year so far and haven't been on here in a while!!  Well I have done a couple things to the car as of lately.
I went from a 10" ebay fan to a 12" Spal curved blade fan, drained my coolant and used some Royal Purple "water wetter" type stuff.  What I used before was distilled water and water-wetter.  I used distilled water per Suzuki.  However that is mixed with antifreeze.  Well I guess distilled water will actually draw minerals out of the cooling jacket and reduce the cooling efficiency?  Well, I now have purified drinking water and that Royal Purple additive.  All things combined, I can run it really REALLY hard in the dunes and it will get up to 210 with a 95* ambient air temp.  I don't push it past that, as I will stop for literally 30 seconds to a min. and it will drop to 190 and stay there under "normal" driving around on the dunes.  Possibly may go to a 4 row Civic rad vs the 2 row I currently have.

I also made some adapters for my bead-lock wheels!  It looks KILLER!  so from going from 8" wide wheels to a 10" wide wheel and 13" wide paddles there is more of a contact patch on the sand.  It really hooks up good now! 

I made some spring adjustments too.  Originally had 300# on the bottom and 250# on the top...WAY over-sprung.  I had 2" of shaft in the body..(LMAO)  I was hoping for 4-5" of shaft in the body..(LMFAO, married mans dream).  I did the math over and over and my simple mind said if you need to drop another 2" cut the poundage in half.  Well, my numbers matched up to the calculations that Downsouth Motorsports came up with.  I should be getting the new coils today.  150 on the bottom with 100 on the top.  This will allow me some pre-load if I needed.  Then I will have to test and possibly some valving.

This car is just too much damn fun!  Not sure if I want to start another build, or do a Busa swap with this car.  Looking at dyno numbers of the 750, bikes are seeing 55# ft of torque at 12k...the first gen busa has that at 2500 rpm...  And this car will pull the front wheels juuuust ever so slightly over a roller at 10-13k RPM.   

Here are some cool pictures!
(https://i.imgur.com/jEB1YRA.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/QO0HNra.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/MyecIvR.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/207DXMF.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/fdb7EHk.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Idiru0b.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 18, 2018, 09:56:08 AM
Some random pics from this year.
(https://i.imgur.com/uuBwnjm.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/87Btevp.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/sbtPIXh.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/QZHXVfd.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/b9Fdtkw.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/mlv2kVJ.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 18, 2018, 09:58:01 AM
MOAR!
(https://i.imgur.com/x9rTXSe.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/hKCJHmh.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/PW8K1KN.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/WYXypQo.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/biFtVn0.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/OppMIfq.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/yAV8dBs.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/TtzQWOj.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 18, 2018, 10:00:24 AM
Even MOAR-ER
(https://i.imgur.com/08STnHX.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/PRsGSAT.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/C643IlO.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/M31gl37.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/dwWix4e.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/WiZ7kCz.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/kvoi9Rq.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/hH0sRFT.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/uNENCcy.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/um5IXrk.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 18, 2018, 10:01:22 AM
And then there is this guy... LMAO
My cars bigg-er brother.
(https://i.imgur.com/bUDmoHx.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/1hZnA3S.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on July 18, 2018, 10:14:08 AM
stu 1300 paddles are far better on traction and lighter weight ( as in 6 lbs per tire) than the sand viper chinese 1300 paddle.  doug never said he met up with you there. very nice pics btw!  also those spring rates ( 250/300) are too heavy for my old v6 sand rail.  so that will make a huge change. i do like the large group of rails for sure!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on July 18, 2018, 10:15:22 AM
btw....i would go with the zx12r before the busa. just my opinion
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 18, 2018, 10:22:08 AM
yeah, Doug headed this way for a bachelor party on Memorial Day Weekend.  Super fun time for sure, and that car is NUTS!!!

The ZX 12, eh.  What are the pros and cons between the 2 engines?

Also, I will probably look into new paddles next spring.  Rotating weight plays a HUGE factor in the dunes for sure!!

The long travel roundup was a way cool event.  Pretty cool when Blake Wilkey shows up for the event too.  As they took that group picture at the bottom of test hill, he did a huge wheelie across the face of the dune.  Freaking RAD!!

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on July 18, 2018, 11:18:53 AM
the busa is a good engine! turbo charged even better but that ninja 12r is a beast! it has the rev of a 1000 but the grunt of a busa. carl would be the guy to ask were to get sprockets and such as they are more a bastard spline. i am fully impressed with the 12r and would go that route if it build another bike powered for myself. he has turbo'd his and really wakes them up big wow factor now!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 19, 2018, 05:33:59 AM
Great points! 
I did some looking for engines yesterday and they are pretty few and far between.  The dyno numbers look really nice too.  Granted those numbers are kinda subjective as they aren't in a sand car but at least they are fairly consistent numbers to look at for reference as the motors are all in bikes for the dyno runs.

Justin

Side note, coils will be going in today.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on July 19, 2018, 07:26:04 AM
Deranged,you have built one fine buggy. It is on par with the best of the best. You can/should be deservedly very proud of your creation. I'll differ from ds on engine though. I'm a busa guy since the sky is the limit of their performance and after market performance parts. Nothing wrong with the zx12 though. Any of the super bikes make loads of hp .
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on July 19, 2018, 08:10:14 AM
Well,
It's been a busy year so far and haven't been on here in a while!!  Well I have done a couple things to the car as of lately.
I went from a 10" ebay fan to a 12" Spal curved blade fan, drained my coolant and used some Royal Purple "water wetter" type stuff.  What I used before was distilled water and water-wetter.  I used distilled water per Suzuki.  However that is mixed with antifreeze.  Well I guess distilled water will actually draw minerals out of the cooling jacket and reduce the cooling efficiency?  Well, I now have purified drinking water and that Royal Purple additive.  All things combined, I can run it really REALLY hard in the dunes and it will get up to 210 with a 95* ambient air temp.  I don't push it past that, as I will stop for literally 30 seconds to a min. and it will drop to 190 and stay there under "normal" driving around on the dunes.  Possibly may go to a 4 row Civic rad vs the 2 row I currently have.

I also made some adapters for my bead-lock wheels!  It looks KILLER!  so from going from 8" wide wheels to a 10" wide wheel and 13" wide paddles there is more of a contact patch on the sand.  It really hooks up good now! 

I made some spring adjustments too.  Originally had 300# on the bottom and 250# on the top...WAY over-sprung.  I had 2" of shaft in the body..(LMAO)  I was hoping for 4-5" of shaft in the body..(LMFAO, married mans dream).  I did the math over and over and my simple mind said if you need to drop another 2" cut the poundage in half.  Well, my numbers matched up to the calculations that Downsouth Motorsports came up with.  I should be getting the new coils today.  150 on the bottom with 100 on the top.  This will allow me some pre-load if I needed.  Then I will have to test and possibly some valving.

This car is just too much damn fun!  Not sure if I want to start another build, or do a Busa swap with this car.  Looking at dyno numbers of the 750, bikes are seeing 55# ft of torque at 12k...the first gen busa has that at 2500 rpm...  And this car will pull the front wheels juuuust ever so slightly over a roller at 10-13k RPM.   


I'm sorry but I gotta call BS on that. The simple truth is that there is no better coolant than 100% distilled water. Is there a problem with running pure distilled? Yup,no corrosion inhibitors. That is why it needs at least some antifreeze in it. Water wetter products ,IMO,are just marketing hype and will absolutely not cool any better than water/antifreeze that also provides ample corrosion protection. If a person is having controlling temps it is simply a matter of either too small a radiator or much more likely too little airflow through the radiator due to either radiator placement of crappy,low cfm fan/s. You shouldn't need or really want a 4 row since the extra restriction will basically stop the airflow through the core. This has been hashed over on many,many forums and in written literature for a very long time now. There is a reason why universally 50/50 distilled and antifreeze is recommended in an engine. On a side note 210 is absolutely not an issue. Hell even at230-240 which is perfectly fine for an engine to run at water will not boil if the cooling system is able to hold enough pressure. Here is a chart to show this. SOOOOO,forget the fancy stuff and get you cooling system airflow and system pressure up to par. 

Here is a chart showing the effect of pressure on boiling point . It's just physics. Honestly,don't worry yourself about keeping the water temp to any certain number like 210 or below. Just run enough system pressure to prevent boiling. Easy peasy. The YXZ's I have all run 220-240 all the time as yamaha designed them to do . I know how hard it is to get comfortable with the higher coolant temps but most all new stuff run hotter by design today. I run approx 33% antifreeze in the busa buggy and the same in the v8 with 20 psi caps. No issues at all.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 19, 2018, 09:00:12 AM
Fabr,
GREAT INFO, and thanks for that chart!  I will be draining my system today and will fill er up with some distilled water and antifreeze.  Ya can't argue with what you have stated at all. 

And for the engines, I agree too with the engines.  I like to have the availability of parts, pieces and whatever may be needed at any given time for an common engine. 

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on July 19, 2018, 09:16:29 AM
The zx12 while I love it, can be a bitch.  Odd ball output sprocket spline, crank trigger is odd number signal.  I worked around it all, had computer stuff reprogrammed, dug up parts, made others.  The 12 revs snappy like a 1000 but w more torque.
 
If I was doing another, Kawasaki H2, or H2R if ya can find.  Factory supercharged sportbike. 
The busa is the king of aftermarket support, makes upgrades easier and cheaper.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 20, 2018, 04:53:08 AM
I will definitely keep the Kawi in mind.  The numbers look really good for sure. 

A little rear spring update.  I put the new coils on last night and bolted on my dirt wheels to take it for a little spin around a construction site near my house.  WOW!  It feels like riding on a cloud now!  There was a small jump if you will.  Normally if I were to hit something like that, it would kick the ass end up.  Not now!  The valving seems to be pretty good too.  I had it on the softest setting on the clicker and I think I can actually stiffen it up a tad.  I may actually now get a slightly lighter spring for the top on the front. 

The rear, I have 4.5" of shaft in the shock in the rear.  (14" shock using 12" of stroke.) 
The front I have 4" of shaft in the shock with a 10" shock.  Seems like I could go another inch into the shock.  This would level the car out and get that front down a little more.
Below is a picture of how the car sits now, with my lovely assistant behind the wheel.
 (https://i.imgur.com/BpYfhlt.jpg)

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 20, 2018, 05:26:25 AM
So i made a quick spreadsheet of my available travel and shock stroke to see where I am at.

It looks like I have 10" of available travel with me in the car and near 11" in the front of available travel. 

So that being said, I think my ride height is pretty spot on, or should I drop down a spring size from 200 to maybe 150?  That will give me a window of adding some preload too.  I will have to crunch some numbers later today.

(https://i.imgur.com/a0OGUOO.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on July 20, 2018, 06:57:22 AM
The answer to that is that there is no actual answer. Suspension tuning is a matter of driver preference and riding conditions within a big window of settings. You are within that window. What do YOU think will make you happy? Personally,I'd go out and drive it and see how you like it now. You made a HUGE spring rate change,need to try it out. As to having the ability to add some pre load if needed,yes you are right BUT you may be happy with the change you made  as it is. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on July 20, 2018, 07:00:27 AM
Fabr,
GREAT INFO, and thanks for that chart!  I will be draining my system today and will fill er up with some distilled water and antifreeze.  Ya can't argue with what you have stated at all. 

And for the engines, I agree too with the engines.  I like to have the availability of parts, pieces and whatever may be needed at any given time for an common engine. 

Justin
Distilled is not an absolutely ,100%,gotta have it or disaster happens thing either. It is the best practice but good clean tap will work almost as well.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on July 20, 2018, 07:30:12 AM
Well,
It's been a busy year so far and haven't been on here in a while!!  Well I have done a couple things to the car as of lately.
I went from a 10" ebay fan to a 12" Spal curved blade fan, drained my coolant and used some Royal Purple "water wetter" type stuff.  What I used before was distilled water and water-wetter.  I used distilled water per Suzuki.  However that is mixed with antifreeze.  Well I guess distilled water will actually draw minerals out of the cooling jacket and reduce the cooling efficiency?  Well, I now have purified drinking water and that Royal Purple additive.  All things combined, I can run it really REALLY hard in the dunes and it will get up to 210 with a 95* ambient air temp.  I don't push it past that, as I will stop for literally 30 seconds to a min. and it will drop to 190 and stay there under "normal" driving around on the dunes.  Possibly may go to a 4 row Civic rad vs the 2 row I currently have.


I thought I'd re-address this point. I called BS on it not because it is incorrect.  Water will always dissolve almost anything into it and make it more impure. That is a fact. SO,that said,yes distilled will draw minerals existing in the water jackets into it. Same with tap water. This is my take on this subject. If using brand new castings and radiator and all new coolant lines there is every reason to use distilled since there are no minerals to get dissolved into the distilled water. On a used block/heads,etc.,the use of distilled is still best practice but good clean tap will likely be just fine due to the fact distilled will "draw out "the deposited minerals coating the water jackets (so will tap water)and in effect turn it right back into tap water. Do I use distilled? Nope. I use 25-30ish% antifreeze to get the needed anti-corrosion and pump seal protection while keeping most of the good heat transfer that pure water would give.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on July 20, 2018, 01:09:42 PM
I will definitely keep the Kawi in mind.  The numbers look really good for sure. 

A little rear spring update.  I put the new coils on last night and bolted on my dirt wheels to take it for a little spin around a construction site near my house.  WOW!  It feels like riding on a cloud now!  There was a small jump if you will.  Normally if I were to hit something like that, it would kick the ass end up.  Not now!  The valving seems to be pretty good too.  I had it on the softest setting on the clicker and I think I can actually stiffen it up a tad.  I may actually now get a slightly lighter spring for the top on the front. 

The rear, I have 4.5" of shaft in the shock in the rear.  (14" shock using 12" of stroke.) 
The front I have 4" of shaft in the shock with a 10" shock.  Seems like I could go another inch into the shock.  This would level the car out and get that front down a little more.
Below is a picture of how the car sits now, with my lovely assistant behind the wheel.
 (https://i.imgur.com/BpYfhlt.jpg)

Justin

really wondered until i saw this type as justing doens't sound female   LMAO LMAO
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on July 20, 2018, 01:25:41 PM
The answer to that is that there is no actual answer. Suspension tuning is a matter of driver preference and riding conditions within a big window of settings. You are within that window. What do YOU think will make you happy? Personally,I'd go out and drive it and see how you like it now. You made a HUGE spring rate change,need to try it out. As to having the ability to add some pre load if needed,yes you are right BUT you may be happy with the change you made  as it is.

i agree with fabr on this one.......tuning is how the driver likes it. setting up a rail for jumping is diff than a smooth ride and again in desert etc etc so set it how yo like it and so it doesn't bottom out.

i do like the idea of the kawi h2. fabr is right the busa has massive support as far as parts and high performance builds go. the yamaha 1.7 vmax is an awsome motor too but the aniversary edition must be a grey hair only bike cause no one seems to wreck them!  ;D ;D ;)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on July 20, 2018, 01:26:51 PM
Well,
It's been a busy year so far and haven't been on here in a while!!  Well I have done a couple things to the car as of lately.
I went from a 10" ebay fan to a 12" Spal curved blade fan, drained my coolant and used some Royal Purple "water wetter" type stuff.  What I used before was distilled water and water-wetter.  I used distilled water per Suzuki.  However that is mixed with antifreeze.  Well I guess distilled water will actually draw minerals out of the cooling jacket and reduce the cooling efficiency?  Well, I now have purified drinking water and that Royal Purple additive.  All things combined, I can run it really REALLY hard in the dunes and it will get up to 210 with a 95* ambient air temp.  I don't push it past that, as I will stop for literally 30 seconds to a min. and it will drop to 190 and stay there under "normal" driving around on the dunes.  Possibly may go to a 4 row Civic rad vs the 2 row I currently have.

I also made some adapters for my bead-lock wheels!  It looks KILLER!  so from going from 8" wide wheels to a 10" wide wheel and 13" wide paddles there is more of a contact patch on the sand.  It really hooks up good now! 

I made some spring adjustments too.  Originally had 300# on the bottom and 250# on the top...WAY over-sprung.  I had 2" of shaft in the body..(LMAO)  I was hoping for 4-5" of shaft in the body..(LMFAO, married mans dream).  I did the math over and over and my simple mind said if you need to drop another 2" cut the poundage in half.  Well, my numbers matched up to the calculations that Downsouth Motorsports came up with.  I should be getting the new coils today.  150 on the bottom with 100 on the top.  This will allow me some pre-load if I needed.  Then I will have to test and possibly some valving.

This car is just too much damn fun!  Not sure if I want to start another build, or do a Busa swap with this car.  Looking at dyno numbers of the 750, bikes are seeing 55# ft of torque at 12k...the first gen busa has that at 2500 rpm...  And this car will pull the front wheels juuuust ever so slightly over a roller at 10-13k RPM.   


I'm sorry but I gotta call BS on that. The simple truth is that there is no better coolant than 100% distilled water. Is there a problem with running pure distilled? Yup,no corrosion inhibitors. That is why it needs at least some antifreeze in it. Water wetter products ,IMO,are just marketing hype and will absolutely not cool any better than water/antifreeze that also provides ample corrosion protection. If a person is having controlling temps it is simply a matter of either too small a radiator or much more likely too little airflow through the radiator due to either radiator placement of crappy,low cfm fan/s. You shouldn't need or really want a 4 row since the extra restriction will basically stop the airflow through the core. This has been hashed over on many,many forums and in written literature for a very long time now. There is a reason why universally 50/50 distilled and antifreeze is recommended in an engine. On a side note 210 is absolutely not an issue. Hell even at230-240 which is perfectly fine for an engine to run at water will not boil if the cooling system is able to hold enough pressure. Here is a chart to show this. SOOOOO,forget the fancy stuff and get you cooling system airflow and system pressure up to par. 

Here is a chart showing the effect of pressure on boiling point . It's just physics. Honestly,don't worry yourself about keeping the water temp to any certain number like 210 or below. Just run enough system pressure to prevent boiling. Easy peasy. The YXZ's I have all run 220-240 all the time as yamaha designed them to do . I know how hard it is to get comfortable with the higher coolant temps but most all new stuff run hotter by design today. I run approx 33% antifreeze in the busa buggy and the same in the v8 with 20 psi caps. No issues at all.




i have never seen a chart like this and very good info. should make that a sticky note.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on July 20, 2018, 07:12:42 PM
Well,
It's been a busy year so far and haven't been on here in a while!!  Well I have done a couple things to the car as of lately.
I went from a 10" ebay fan to a 12" Spal curved blade fan, drained my coolant and used some Royal Purple "water wetter" type stuff.  What I used before was distilled water and water-wetter.  I used distilled water per Suzuki.  However that is mixed with antifreeze.  Well I guess distilled water will actually draw minerals out of the cooling jacket and reduce the cooling efficiency?  Well, I now have purified drinking water and that Royal Purple additive.  All things combined, I can run it really REALLY hard in the dunes and it will get up to 210 with a 95* ambient air temp.  I don't push it past that, as I will stop for literally 30 seconds to a min. and it will drop to 190 and stay there under "normal" driving around on the dunes.  Possibly may go to a 4 row Civic rad vs the 2 row I currently have.

I also made some adapters for my bead-lock wheels!  It looks KILLER!  so from going from 8" wide wheels to a 10" wide wheel and 13" wide paddles there is more of a contact patch on the sand.  It really hooks up good now! 

I made some spring adjustments too.  Originally had 300# on the bottom and 250# on the top...WAY over-sprung.  I had 2" of shaft in the body..(LMAO)  I was hoping for 4-5" of shaft in the body..(LMFAO, married mans dream).  I did the math over and over and my simple mind said if you need to drop another 2" cut the poundage in half.  Well, my numbers matched up to the calculations that Downsouth Motorsports came up with.  I should be getting the new coils today.  150 on the bottom with 100 on the top.  This will allow me some pre-load if I needed.  Then I will have to test and possibly some valving.

This car is just too much damn fun!  Not sure if I want to start another build, or do a Busa swap with this car.  Looking at dyno numbers of the 750, bikes are seeing 55# ft of torque at 12k...the first gen busa has that at 2500 rpm...  And this car will pull the front wheels juuuust ever so slightly over a roller at 10-13k RPM.   


I'm sorry but I gotta call BS on that. The simple truth is that there is no better coolant than 100% distilled water. Is there a problem with running pure distilled? Yup,no corrosion inhibitors. That is why it needs at least some antifreeze in it. Water wetter products ,IMO,are just marketing hype and will absolutely not cool any better than water/antifreeze that also provides ample corrosion protection. If a person is having controlling temps it is simply a matter of either too small a radiator or much more likely too little airflow through the radiator due to either radiator placement of crappy,low cfm fan/s. You shouldn't need or really want a 4 row since the extra restriction will basically stop the airflow through the core. This has been hashed over on many,many forums and in written literature for a very long time now. There is a reason why universally 50/50 distilled and antifreeze is recommended in an engine. On a side note 210 is absolutely not an issue. Hell even at230-240 which is perfectly fine for an engine to run at water will not boil if the cooling system is able to hold enough pressure. Here is a chart to show this. SOOOOO,forget the fancy stuff and get you cooling system airflow and system pressure up to par. 

Here is a chart showing the effect of pressure on boiling point . It's just physics. Honestly,don't worry yourself about keeping the water temp to any certain number like 210 or below. Just run enough system pressure to prevent boiling. Easy peasy. The YXZ's I have all run 220-240 all the time as yamaha designed them to do . I know how hard it is to get comfortable with the higher coolant temps but most all new stuff run hotter by design today. I run approx 33% antifreeze in the busa buggy and the same in the v8 with 20 psi caps. No issues at all.




i have never seen a chart like this and very good info. should make that a sticky note.
You asked,you received.   https://dtsfab.com/index.php?topic=5671.0   ;D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on July 23, 2018, 06:30:21 AM
First run with the new spring set up.
Well, my GoPro case broke, so I didn't get any video.  BOOOO.  So I took it to Silver Lake yesterday and did a lap.  SOOOO much better! 
Initial comments.  Add more pre-load and tighten up the compression as the adjusters were all the way soft.  I added maybe 1.5" of preload and went put 5 clicks on the compression.
MUCHO better.  The initial setting would work for normal dune cruising.  Well, i'm not a cruiser.  LOL  I smacked the ass end a couple times pretty hard, hence a little more preload.

The dune conditions were pretty rough as it rained pretty good yesterday and there were some nasty whoops.  Not the normal whoops, but the deep one right at the bottom of the hill before you go up.  Even some of the bigger cars were slowing down there. 
One thing I noticed was at higher speed, the car worked really well and felt really good with no bottoming out.  Where I bottomed out was the dips per say, where you are going along and its a slight roller going down and then back up.  Not a whoop by any means.  This is where I would almost always bottom the ass end out.  Is this where slow speed dampening comes into play??

I think I will pull the front apart now and install a flutter stack.  The one I put in the rear is very evident that it is in there....Or is that where my low speed dampening is showing?
Time to research.  LOL

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on July 23, 2018, 03:42:24 PM
very good news. now get some damn video!!  ;) ;) rofl so are you coming down to LS in oklahoma in oct when doug does?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on July 26, 2018, 06:45:56 PM
Come on down!!! I promise you you will like our dunes a LOT more than what you are used to. Hell,you might even like the group in person.  :nw :m
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on August 20, 2018, 05:18:34 AM
Mornin' fellas!

Once again, work had me all over the place the past 3 weeks. 
YES!  I've GOTTA get down to LS with you guys!! I will roam around to find the fall trip thread.   

I am currently doing some mid season maintenance.
-New CV grease
-Some new Delrin rear suspension bushings
-New rear sprocket
-New clutch
-Oil change
-Fresh coolant
-Re-valve the rear shocks.  (Take out the flutter stack)
-New heim joints on the front suspension.

Currently i'm 1/2 way with the funds to go go out and pay cash for a Busa.  I like the availability to parts and tuning for those engines.

After my last trip my back really started hurting...and it wasn't going away.  I can't tell if it's that I just turned 40, or something is going on.  I see my doc today as he was leaning toward a cracked vertebrate or a bulged/ruptured disk. BOOOO!! 

Here are a couple more wheels up pictures!
(https://i.imgur.com/9CAbnrI.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/veQB7QE.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on August 20, 2018, 09:50:17 AM
nice pics....need more padding in the seat for the back issue. my back hurts an its not from a disc. i just posted two replies in the fall trip thread. so you should be able to find it easy now.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 07, 2018, 10:32:13 AM
So I am currently working a modification of the car. I am getting rid of the light bar and swapping that out with 3, 4" HID lights. The light bar didn't put out near as much light as I was expecting. Heck, I think just one of the HID units put out more light than the bar!

Well what I did was I made up a couple of U shaped pieces out of 1" .062 wall tubing and welded them into an oval. I then mounted that to the old light bar mounts.

With everything mocked up it looks pretty cool!

Tonight I will be making a tie rod of sorts that will go just above the middle light and extend back to my chassis. This will stabilize the assembly as well as give me quick and accurate up and down adjustment. Stay tuned!

Oh, in regards to my back issue.  I saw the physical therapist today.  He was very quick to identify the issue. My Sacrum which is what your spine attaches to and also connects everything to your hip bones.  Mine was twisted, rotated and crooked.  I could actually rotate my upper body to the left more than 25* more than if I were to rotate my upper body to the right.  After 45 min of him pulling, pushing, twisting and everything else imaginable he got that 90% back in place.  He said I should be 100% by the end of the month.

(https://i.imgur.com/Kqux71p.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/z8szRMJ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/e8So6dA.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 07, 2018, 11:21:00 AM
looks great. you will like those lights.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Voodoochikin04 on September 07, 2018, 07:49:59 PM
the lights and the hoop look great.  I remember how nice it was to get just 2 HID's installed. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 13, 2018, 05:12:51 AM
The light project turned out pretty good! I added a tie rod to adjust the lights up and down and got it all painted up.
The stock GSXR light circuit did NOT like the addition of these lights. LOL So today I will be running 3 individual circuits from the battery, to 3 relays and 3 switches. That way I can turn each light on one at a time to reduce the initial start-up strain in the battery and charging system. I will know how well they work this Saturday. It's the last day that the dunes are open until 10pm. I was out there last Saturday and it gets reallllly dark. Just my 2 cheap Ebay LED lights on the front of my car did pretty good for what they are.

I also went back to the valving that came with the shocks that King calculated.  A-LOT better.  I just wish they didn't screw up the spring rates as bad as they did.  LOL  Oh-well.  It does very well over the woops at speed.  I will be at the dunes again this weekend and I make SURE to get some video this time. 

I finished up installing a new clutch as well.  In another post I found that my inner clutch basket had some grooves from the metal disks.  I just said screw it and filed off the nasty and ran it.  No funky clutch engagement noticed.  I will be inquiring on an 05 Busa engine that is local to me, so wish me luck. 
(https://i.imgur.com/bPGorG9.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/yFtF9Q0.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/MHqLltz.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/llwAGIg.jpg)


Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: budlight69 on September 13, 2018, 10:09:25 AM
The light bar came out very nice.  I have those same lights and installed some 3M clear film over the plastic covers to protect from sand blasting. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 13, 2018, 10:43:07 AM
EXCELLENT call on the 3M film!

Oh, and I just bought an 05 Hayabusa with 13,000 miles, complete with header, gauges, wiring, rectifier, ECU and oil cooler!

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 13, 2018, 11:17:46 AM
well the 05 is a great year to buy. so are you keeping it n/a?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 14, 2018, 06:06:33 AM
For now, I will keep it NA.  Maybe I will do a turbo next winter.  Headed to pick it up now!

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 14, 2018, 06:08:53 AM
good plan.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 14, 2018, 08:13:48 AM
i asked as i still have a cold air intake that just happened to come of 05 busa throttle bodies. i can bring it to the dunes with me. http://skipsbuggy.com/skipsbuggy_005.htm
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 14, 2018, 10:37:46 AM
great looking buggy,one of the nicest I have seen, but you gotta move that flag to the back for it not to look bass ackwards.  5: :m :m 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 17, 2018, 10:22:05 AM
DS,
I'm not sure if that will fit on the throttle bodies as it might hit the radiator. 
Bring it to LS and we will see if it may work.

Fabr,
Iv'e got some rear (backwards 8) mounts for my flags.  Here in the mitten, we have to run em this way.  It's easy to identify the cars that came from out of state as they have a flag mount in the rear/mid of the car. 

So it was really nice to deal with a local salvage yard to get my engine.  It's very nice to actually buy something like this in person.  He threw in a keyed ignition, a 2-Brothers Juice Box and said to get a hold of him when I needed any other parts as he would heavily discount them for being local.
The bike it came out of was a custom painted bike with all sorts of polished stuff on it.  More of a show bike rather than a weekend drag bike. 

Doing some initial measurements it will be a tight squeeze but it will go in.  I currently have an electronics box under my radiator that has my battery, ECU, overflow can, tip over switch, kickstand switch and some fuses.  That is a PITA to access.  So that will all be moved under the front "hood" for easy access.  I then can possibly run a taller radiator and open things up in the back a bit.
(https://i.imgur.com/QusXmxl.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/ChYpxfb.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/LVv4JRP.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Aq9ireZ.jpg)
Oh, and a quick video from Saturday night.  Let me know if it's posted right for a video.
(https://i.imgur.com/Z79R4cI.mp4)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 17, 2018, 10:34:28 AM
what ever you do make sure you keep an oil cooler, stock or aftermarket as it did make a diff on mine. also .....is there a case saver on the clutch slave cyl? if you go heavier clutch ( as you will need to ) then it will need one.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 17, 2018, 10:43:42 AM
Absolutely on the oil cooler.  In fact I already have an oil cooler that I got when I bought the radiator from Rick.  It's a 9 row cooler with #10 AN fittings.  I've gotta look for the AN adapters to replace the ones that go on the block.
You mentioned a case saver.  I'm assuming that with heavier springs that hydraulic master cylinder may flex the stock cover?  I also saw a case saver for the starter side to prevent cracking on a misfire cold start?  Cheap insurance I guess.
Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 17, 2018, 10:45:02 AM
It has a chrome cover as seen below.  I'll be ditching all the chrome.  LOL  Except the chrome oil cap.  I like that.
(https://i.imgur.com/QusXmxl.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 17, 2018, 10:48:30 AM
YES,keep an oil cooler on it. A slave support is almost mandatory with the heavy clutch springs that you WILL want.  The busa has the classic road rash. Seems like all busa engines for sale have it. LOL!!! I recently saw one for sale with 3 miles on the odometer. Damn thing must have slid forever. It was worn clear through the covers.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 17, 2018, 10:51:57 AM
Zero need for the starter support with a stock engine N/A or turbo. If it was a high compression bad ass N/A engine it would be wise to add one though.The slave support is a yes with heavy springs.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 17, 2018, 10:58:07 AM
Holy crap!  3 miles!?  Must have fallen off a transport trailer.

Any suggestions on clutches for the Hayabusa?  I do have to do some research on them for sure to see what works and what doesn't.  Especially when it's off road, not on the streets.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 17, 2018, 12:01:50 PM
Stock frictions with stock steels and heavy duty springs are the best,IMO.   New owner bought busa and promptly crashed it right after entering freeway. Dude had no idea how powerful they are and it bit him in the ass. I heard it went down at over 140.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 17, 2018, 01:34:53 PM
slave support.....https://store.schnitzracing.com/schnitz-clutch-slave-support-bracket-suzuki-gsx1300r-hayabusa-99-07/


i do agree with fabr , heavier springs and stock steels and friction with heavier springs but your choice ( i went aftermarket clutch kit but didn't know)......https://store.schnitzracing.com/ape-clutch-spring-kit-suzuki-gsx1300r-hayabusa-99-07/


and i put one of these in, made a diff imo and would do it again......https://store.schnitzracing.com/brocks-clutch-mod-suzuki-gsx1300r-hayabusa-99-18/
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 17, 2018, 01:52:26 PM
Definitely some solid info on the clutch set up.  I will have to do some digging on the clutch mod and what it does.  There will be some launches as Iv'e got some RZR's out there at the dunes I want to embarrass.  LOL

I actually had a wild hair in my ass to re configure the rear suspension slightly to get more travel and the addition of bypasses.  I'll get into that tomorrow after some head scratching. 

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 18, 2018, 05:27:32 AM
All right,
After looking at the rear of my car, I think there can be some improvements.  I really like the way the car handles with the a arms.  However looking at the car from a plan view (above) the center spool center-line and the micro-stub center line are on 2 different planes.  Roughly 2".  Correct me if i'm wrong, but I believe I can get more travel if those 2 center lines (spool and stub) were in line?  Say its 3* forward and i center things up, would you agree that may be more down travel as far as the CV angles go?
Below is the plan view.
 (https://i.imgur.com/hEPZRTc.jpg)

By thought is to build new arms and a trailing link if you will to center things up.  ALSO, add 2" to each side.  My other idea is to keep the shock in it's position and add a bypass.  I think I can squeeze another 3" out if it, possibly 1" more if I step up to a 30" tire and the track width would be around 80"

Thoughts?   
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 18, 2018, 10:30:30 AM
i understand your thought process of gaining 3* here and move it there. the way the chain adjusts you will always have some misalignent there. if the a arms truly stroke straight up and down and no rake at the cradle then that 3* offset is due to  wheel base with out changing the chassis imo. big question is how much axle plunge do you currently have? 2nd... how much angle are your running now? how long are your axles? what is the track width with paddles on?  i ask these questions as i run non plunge 930 cv's. with the turbo busa i had , i had them limited at 35* withy straps. now on my current i have them limited at 30* and am using the same cvs from before which are going on 5 years old.

bypass shocks would/are fantastic.  if the lower arms were wider at the frame you wouldnt need that link bar. it def seems to work.


i want to say that when designing an a arm rear end that everything does need to pivot at the same points. so that 3* offeset really shouldnt be there. must be a reason for it. however, straightening those lines wont gain you a lot of wheel travel imo. longer axles and higher angle cvs would.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 18, 2018, 01:11:50 PM
what is this angle?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 19, 2018, 07:06:16 AM
Great conversation.
As far as wheelbase, i'm not too concerned unless it affects akerman.  Good call on the chain adjustment.  That is 1.25" overall.
I will have to measure the plunge later today.  I think it was designed to be around 1/8" or so, maybe less as Rick was pretty picky in the design.
I am running 24" axles and at full droop they are 26* and the track width is 78" or so.  I DO have 1.250" wheel adapters currently.  I will be getting rid of them and re drilling my flanges.  That will allow me to widen the rear out to gain more usable travel.
I am interested in the non plunging CV's.  Those, coupled with a little wider track width could achieve a fair amount of added travel.

I will be keeping everything the way it is until after the LS trip, but starting some R&D now to get a good plan.  Everything about the car is awesome.  It handles very good, but would be so much better with more rear travel.

The angle at which the radius arm is to the arm is appx 50* at while full droop.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 19, 2018, 08:48:58 AM
https://www.rcvperformance.com/ultimate-non-plunging-fixed-930-cv-joint-chromoly-cage-and-28-spline.html


so one thing to consider is that in an ideal situation we want our front tires tracking down the center of our rears. does your currently? if the front end is wider then widening the rear would def be a plus. 

on that forward link rod....45* is imo max angle so 50* from be to far but it works then it works.

if this rick person does indeed have axle plunge down to 1/8" plunge or less as i have on the last several then i am surprised he hasn't gone to non plunge 930's?? ideal would be to take that 1.25" from chain adjustment and split it then center the axle on that line so the offset is equal when adjusted.  having that axle centerline off centered from the pivot points of the a arms actually can create axle plunge, surprised the designer did that. so if you take the width of the wheel adaptor and if the front is wider then add that and you'll get your new axle length #.

Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 19, 2018, 09:56:13 AM
The front has the same spacers as the rear.  Oh, I didn't tell you that I was going to widen the front too.  HAA!!  I'm going for some good travel numbers on this car.  I currently am pulling 18" up front.  I will be doing a fabricated plate lower that will be 1-2" wider each side, beef up the bushings as well.

In fact the guy that designed it has F-150 outers available to slide into my intrepid bearing.  Below is the link. 
http://www.rickskraschsite.com/catalog.php?ProdID=GM-874

I will be speaking with him to review his idea around the axles going forward.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 19, 2018, 10:37:57 AM
i ran the f150 cv/stub and the actual f150 wheel bearing on my turbo busa. well glad your widening the front too and since you are...... set it all up so the front tires track down the center of the rear tires. if possible pull that rear link bar back to 45* ( off center of axle) or slghtly less ( if possible it works so could leave it).

 post up why the builder offset the axle like that. i am not saying its a bad thing just curious why.

just for an idea.....my current rails rear track width is 96" with paddles. front is 80" and i have 24" wheel travel. rims on rear are 12" wide with 4.5" back spacing , fronts are 5" wide and 3.5" back spacing. my fronts are close to on center tracking with rears. i run 28" axles on non plunge 930 cv's.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 19, 2018, 01:28:55 PM
Well I got some feedback from the designer of the car. 
His idea was to keep the car as short as possible, thus raking the drive axles forward in turn sacrificing some travel.
Well, this car is gonna get slightly longer....in many ways. LOL

There is a chap over down-under who destroyed one of his f-150 CV's with a Busa powered car.  Not sure how.  I may just run the non plunging 930's all around and keep things common.

I will probably keep the radius rod where it is on the chassis and look at a different location on the lower arm.   

Plan of attack.  Goal of 18-20" of rear travel @ under 80" wide and 20-21" up front.
-Design different lower and upper arms to fit the chassis as well as the upright +2 per side. 
-Lowers to be plate/box design and uppers tube.
-Design so that the spool center matches the micro stub.  (chain adjuster in the central location)
-24" axles to 26" axles
-Non plunging 930 CV swap
-Take the front design and widen the same as the rear.  (shock location will stay and the +2 addition will be from the shock out)
-Lowers will be plate/box and the uppers will be tube.
-Oh yeah, Busa swap. LOL
-MAYBE 2" 3 tube bypasses in the rear.
I guess I will be busy this winter!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 19, 2018, 01:53:40 PM
well you officially completed the hardest part.....the plan!  :D

i dont think i saw the wheel base listed but could've missed it. all of the mid engine 2 seats i built were 106" plus. the 3 v6 and turbo 2.3 have been 107 to 117" wb. 106" on the "mini's" has always worked out great. i prefer 84" plus on track width in the rear for stability but thats personal opinion. of corse with 24" of usable travel one needs 28" ground clearence plus to achieve 24" usable travel. so the higher they go the wider they have to get.     

i agree on all 4 np 930's....keeps it simple. i normally have 2 spares. hope i never need them but got em.    i never had any issues with the f150 cv itself but did have a wheel bearing wear out faster then i thought. seems like on a few diff rails, always the drivers side first.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 19, 2018, 04:37:05 PM
slave support.....https://store.schnitzracing.com/schnitz-clutch-slave-support-bracket-suzuki-gsx1300r-hayabusa-99-07/


i do agree with fabr , heavier springs and stock steels and friction with heavier springs but your choice ( i went aftermarket clutch kit but didn't know)......https://store.schnitzracing.com/ape-clutch-spring-kit-suzuki-gsx1300r-hayabusa-99-07/


and i put one of these in, made a diff imo and would do it again......https://store.schnitzracing.com/brocks-clutch-mod-suzuki-gsx1300r-hayabusa-99-18/
5 minutes with the TIG and you have the same thing.That saves you something like $248. ;)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 19, 2018, 04:47:56 PM
Sounds like you have a solid plan for upgrades.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 20, 2018, 06:31:07 AM
Good call on TIG welding that part!  I've still gotta get all my background info on what that actually does.  LOL

As for my wheelbase, it is currently 85" long.  A short lil fella. 

I have had thoughts of building a new chassis...  Nope, don't do it..... But it could be a 2 seat rocket...Don't do it..Modify the existing car and have fun.

 LMAO  Did I have an argument by myself on a forum post?? 5:

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 20, 2018, 07:51:30 AM
85" wb wow! that is as small as an honda odyssey! the back tq limiter is that part that i posted a link to and fabr a diy link. it chattered like mad in mine and after replacing it the take off were a whole lot smoother. welding the stock together is not a bad idea but i would think one would want to get it balanced afterwords to be safe.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 20, 2018, 11:18:02 AM
HA!!!!  Yeah she's a lil short girl. 

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 20, 2018, 11:42:48 AM
85" wb wow! that is as small as an honda odyssey! the back tq limiter is that part that i posted a link to and fabr a diy link. it chattered like mad in mine and after replacing it the take off were a whole lot smoother. welding the stock together is not a bad idea but i would think one would want to get it balanced afterwords to be safe.
Zero need to balance it unless you are a booger welder.Absolutely no one does so.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 20, 2018, 12:24:37 PM
if i remember right the brocks aluminum clutch mod ( posted link on last page ) is like 1.7lbs lighter than stock and balanced.  fabr i have no doubt that many have welded them together and ran them but thats a fair amount of rotating weight imo.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 20, 2018, 01:03:00 PM
HA!  I FINALLY have a video.
I am learning to do some editing but it's freaking tricky and time usually does not allow.

I am seeing that on some high speed hits, the rebound is rather slow. 

Take a peek!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G04xsZvTaJw
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 20, 2018, 01:16:30 PM
WHAT!?!  Another one??
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L_wRZAklcFs
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 20, 2018, 02:11:36 PM
i have a few videos i have spent 20 plus hrs editing. been years and dont do that anymore lol

nice videos btw. the first one looked like a really wide fast trail. that looks like a blast. the vehicles lined up on the dunes like doves on a powerline seems to chboke the flow down. nice flatter straight away to open your toys thats always a must! havent watched the 2nd yet and will but i would suggest waiting until LS to adjust rebound for high speed hits  ;D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 20, 2018, 02:39:12 PM
second video reminds me a lot of the south side of LS dunes. looked like a fun run!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 20, 2018, 06:11:25 PM
if i remember right the brocks aluminum clutch mod ( posted link on last page ) is like 1.7lbs lighter than stock and balanced.  fabr i have no doubt that many have welded them together and ran them but thats a fair amount of rotating weight imo.
The rotating weight is within a tight rotating radius. The few inch/grams it could possibly be out is inconsequential. The mass to accelerate is basically the same thing due to the very small rotating radius. Pretty much a non issue unless drag racing looking for another possible hundredth or more likely a few thousandths of a second. I mean,do you balance your frictions and steels in the clutch? Nope,why not? Because the few inch/grams out doesn't matter.  The Brocks aluminum part is not balanced at all (neither is the stocker),it is just machined and if the thing is machined accurately ,which can be doubtful in the aftermarket,it is inherently good but it is not balanced after machining. The balance is dependent on machining precision.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 20, 2018, 06:32:37 PM
 Nice vids! BTW,where are your arm restraints!?!?!?!?!!???!!!!!! 5:
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 20, 2018, 06:53:03 PM
Yep,good vids and looks like a fun place especially not having to worry about who is coming at you with the one way thing but might get a bit old quick with so little differing terrain. I know I would have fun but not enough to make a trip. You ,on the other hand,will be quite glad you made the trip to LS for sure! Great prep for a St.A trip...... ;D ;D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 21, 2018, 04:54:44 AM
Nice vids! BTW,where are your arm restraints!?!?!?!?!!???!!!!!! 5:
Ahhh Shoot. 
I left them in the bedroom... rofl rofl rofl
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 21, 2018, 04:57:49 AM
Yep,good vids and looks like a fun place especially not having to worry about who is coming at you with the one way thing but might get a bit old quick with so little differing terrain. I know I would have fun but not enough to make a trip. You ,on the other hand,will be quite glad you made the trip to LS for sure! Great prep for a St.A trip...... ;D ;D

50% are directional up here in the mitten.  I usually go everywhere.  Kinda the beauty of a small nimble car.
The good thing is I live an hour from the sand and with it being on Lake Michigan the terrain is constantly changing.  One good jump on a Saturday, may not even be there in 7 days.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 21, 2018, 06:05:37 AM
My mistake. I thought SL was all directional . Since you are used to dinky dunes you might want to try out Beaver Dunes and Syracuse dunes as well in the area. I wouldn't ever go to either again on purpose but it seems like many of us get curious once. Once is all it takes. :m
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 21, 2018, 07:04:17 AM
My mistake. I thought SL was all directional . Since you are used to dinky dunes you might want to try out Beaver Dunes and Syracuse dunes as well in the area. I wouldn't ever go to either again on purpose but it seems like many of us get curious once. Once is all it takes. :m

never been to beaver dunes and never will. heard from several it's ok on a quad so not worth the time on a rail. i will re visit syracuse someday just to see the changes since i was only there once the 2nd year it was open. i do have to agree, it wasn't impressive back then! the town was/is a lot nicer than waynoka for sure but they need to open the dunes up and kill the vegetation!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 21, 2018, 11:21:16 AM
do a google earth and see its still a shithole.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 21, 2018, 11:26:13 AM
 rofl

to be honest if st a idaho wasnt 15 to 16 hrs away and closer to 10 to 11 hrs i prob would skip LS  :D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 22, 2018, 07:36:45 AM
here is a video of one of our dts group runs at st anthony idaho sand dunes. everyone but fabr is in the run. he was in town getting an issue fixed on his toter. someday you should consider a trip to st a. doug can fill you in on the drive as he has made it twice. those are the med ish sized dunes in the video. it was cloudy and my go pro doesn't work well in those conditions. no matter you can get a gauge of the dunes in the video. youtube music as they wouldn't allow what i had picked so its cheesy.

https://youtu.be/ZlAeXjrf30o
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 22, 2018, 09:51:41 AM
Great vid! Who is that ugly fooker at the end?














 :m LMAO rofl rofl ;D ;D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 23, 2018, 07:27:17 AM
that's called poor editing  ;D ;D rofl atleast i had my head condom on so there was no glare  rofl
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 23, 2018, 07:31:59 AM
Great vid! Who is that ugly fooker at the end?


 ;D ;D

https://youtu.be/rr36P5zGtBk














 :m LMAO rofl rofl ;D ;D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 23, 2018, 09:28:47 AM
Another ugly effer! With a broke car no less. Oh,the shame!!!! Well,at least we hear what a car with a totally blown head gasket sounds like starting up. LMAO 5: :nw  It's fixed now,hopefully for the last time.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 23, 2018, 09:56:58 AM
i expect to see it in oct!  ;D ;)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 23, 2018, 10:20:32 AM
Possibly will take black buggy,blue buggy won't make it ,I might just play with the yxz's this time though. Won't have to take anything but the dually down since the yxz's are already there in their home away from home just waiting for me to get there. Pretty nice to just get in truck ,drive down,open garage and ride. Still tying up a few loose ends now on black like tuning and finalizing the HVAC in it .I'll be down there a couple more times before our group goes playing with the go-karts..  We'll see what happens. No matter,it's all fun.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on September 24, 2018, 07:37:04 AM
Look at how SMOOTH that sand is!!!  Makes SL look like the damn Baja 100!  HAA!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 24, 2018, 07:58:02 AM
It won't be that smooth when you get here. The massive increase in sxs traffic has ruined the smooth sand thing. It will be rutted up unless we get some decent winds . It used to smooth out over night. Seems like it takes 2-3 days of good wind now.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on September 24, 2018, 08:00:03 AM
Oops,I think you were talking about St.A. Yup,miles and miles of smooth sand for sure. Unless you show up during/after utv invasion week or whatever they call i t.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on September 24, 2018, 09:22:22 AM
i dont think its possible to run out of smooth sand at st a even on a busy day. its just to big of a dune.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 06, 2018, 08:14:44 AM
Well all righty...
Things escalated rapidly in the garage last Sunday.  I got a wild hair up my ass to get going on something.  That turned into pulling the ole 750 out of the car, along with the wiring, body panels and cooling system.  The Busa is going in...but not before some modifications....  Yeah, I can't leave anything alone.  The worst part is the car just ran SO GOOD!  Well, it can only get better, right?
The engine WILL fit into the chassis, but...BUT it is really cramped.  I got to doing some measuring and microsoft paint renderings as seen below. 

The car is going to be a lot faster, so why not make it handle better as well.  I will be stretching the chassis 10-15".  I can do this without hacking the crap out of the chassis.  In fact, I can build the whole rear end on the bench.
I will be going with non plunging 930's and an equal length upper and lower arms to get the car to 80" overall width and the wheelbase to 100" or so.
Iv'e got a really good idea to hold the center spool and adjuster so that it will be really stout and also incorporate the back 2 engine mounts.  It should keep things nice an aligned for fabrication.  Just taking the original design to a new level.  It will be more of a bulkhead design.
 (https://i.imgur.com/ztWUqFJ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/yE0kXvo.jpg)
Below is the chassis currently.  The yellow lines represent where I will be cutting.  I have a buyer for the entire rear clip too!
(https://i.imgur.com/0mse3TB.jpg)
Here is my highly skilled updated chassis design.  LOL
(https://i.imgur.com/7RgXIqv.jpg)

Well, time to get building!!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 06, 2018, 08:20:47 AM
I should also add that I will be doing a behind the seat fuel tank too.  This will allow more room for the radiator and my center exit exhaust. 
Now to figure out what fuel pump and regulator to go with.  I will be setting it up to eventually run on corn.  Any pump ideas?

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 06, 2018, 08:21:04 AM
I LIKE it.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 06, 2018, 08:30:48 AM
I should also add that I will be doing a behind the seat fuel tank too.  This will allow more room for the radiator and my center exit exhaust. 
Now to figure out what fuel pump and regulator to go with.  I will be setting it up to eventually run on corn.  Any pump ideas?

Justin
Made for corn.  More than enough capacity. I have 2 feeding my big car V8 EFI.  http://walbrofuelpumps.com/450lph-walbro-e85-racing-fuel-pump-f90000267.html
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 06, 2018, 09:56:29 AM
if you weld a sump into the tank to accept the stock busa fuel pump head ( like i and others have with fuel sender), then here is your choice. https://store.schnitzracing.com/aem-320-lph-high-flow-in-tank-e85-fuel-pump-suzuki-gsx1300r-hayabusa-01-12/   the programmable fuel gauges from speed hut work very well with the busa fuel sender btw!

fabr listed a very good choice as well, i ran one of those once.

installed a bosch 044 frame rail mount in dougs yellow rail on e85. not rated for it but those pumps are cheap and it's still going strong to 20 psi boost through 1000cc inj's. just saying

Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 06, 2018, 10:00:37 AM
i think i have this one at home that i ran with the turbo set up on my rail.  https://store.schnitzracing.com/aem-320-lph-high-flow-in-tank-fuel-pump-suzuki-gsx1300r-hayabusa-01-12/



i asked carl to write up a little review with pic's of the new bazzaz system .  https://www.bazzaz.net/index.php/suzuki/gsx1300r-02-07
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on December 06, 2018, 10:26:05 AM
Carl sucks lately w buggy stuff.  LOL  Its cold/winter and buggy is packed in trailer.

But the new Bazzaz sys, is e-85 compatible with a newer O2 sensor.  I have my maps setup to e65 I believe with this turbo zx12.  Larger injectors 500cc, stock 330cc. 
Bit of learning curve with turbo e85 maps for me.  Its getting there.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 06, 2018, 03:45:09 PM
Carl sucks lately w buggy stuff.  LOL  Its cold/winter and buggy is packed in trailer.

But the new Bazzaz sys, is e-85 compatible with a newer O2 sensor.  I have my maps setup to e65 I believe with this turbo zx12.  Larger injectors 500cc, stock 330cc. 
Bit of learning curve with turbo e85 maps for me.  Its getting there.

that's your review??  rofl rofl
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 06, 2018, 06:41:12 PM
Welllll,it's honest.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on December 07, 2018, 04:30:37 AM
Carl sucks lately w buggy stuff.  LOL  Its cold/winter and buggy is packed in trailer.

But the new Bazzaz sys, is e-85 compatible with a newer O2 sensor.  I have my maps setup to e65 I believe with this turbo zx12.  Larger injectors 500cc, stock 330cc. 
Bit of learning curve with turbo e85 maps for me.  Its getting there.

that's your review??  rofl rofl
I'll try harder, cosctruction business is off the chain, and new position doesnt let me sit in office all day. LOL
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 07, 2018, 05:50:56 AM
GREAT info guys! 
Looks like i will be spending some money with Schnitz this winter!

I wonder if my stock 750 fuel pump assembly will work, with obviously updating the pump.

One step at a time.  LOL
Iv'e gotta do some cutting first!

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 07, 2018, 07:45:42 AM
Carl sucks lately w buggy stuff.  LOL  Its cold/winter and buggy is packed in trailer.

But the new Bazzaz sys, is e-85 compatible with a newer O2 sensor.  I have my maps setup to e65 I believe with this turbo zx12.  Larger injectors 500cc, stock 330cc. 
Bit of learning curve with turbo e85 maps for me.  Its getting there.

that's your review??  rofl rofl
I'll try harder, cosctruction business is off the chain, and new position doesnt let me sit in office all day. LOL


stop it, you still spending too much time playing with your vette! we get it  LMAO LMAO :nw rofl rofl
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 07, 2018, 07:48:24 AM
GREAT info guys! 
Looks like i will be spending some money with Schnitz this winter!

I wonder if my stock 750 fuel pump assembly will work, with obviously updating the pump.

One step at a time.  LOL
Iv'e gotta do some cutting first!

Justin

yes

if you have returnless fuel then you have a fuel reg in that plastic body like the busa....probably  :D    i cut that plastic assembly apart and removed mine then went extern reg so i could set it .
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 07, 2018, 11:40:18 AM
Carl sucks lately w buggy stuff.  LOL  Its cold/winter and buggy is packed in trailer.

But the new Bazzaz sys, is e-85 compatible with a newer O2 sensor.  I have my maps setup to e65 I believe with this turbo zx12.  Larger injectors 500cc, stock 330cc. 
Bit of learning curve with turbo e85 maps for me.  Its getting there.

that's your review??  rofl rofl
I'll try harder, cosctruction business is off the chain, and new position doesnt let me sit in office all day. LOL


stop it, you still spending too much time playing with your vette! we get it  LMAO LMAO :nw rofl rofl
The new is bound to wear off sometime.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 07, 2018, 03:10:44 PM
the newness fades after the first set of tires......not there yet  rofl :m :m :m :m rofl rofl LMAO LMAO LMAO
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 07, 2018, 05:31:42 PM
Better start driving the damn thing then..................
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on December 10, 2018, 05:50:15 AM
You guys,  LMAO LMAO LMAO

Be sure ya leave enough room for the turbo and header in front, cause that will be next step.  Like drugs, little bit is a blast first time, then more more more more!!!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 10, 2018, 05:56:35 AM
Yep, the fuel pump has that internal regulator.  No worries, as I will use an external regulator.

So I cut the car in half...  That sucked.  LOL

I did some initial math and a CAD-ish layout.
24" equal length arms, 10" center to center vertically on the chassis and the uprights.  At 40*, this gave me 21" of travel with 5" of ground to chassis with a 30" tire.  I will probably strap it to 20".  Huge improvement from the 15" I had.  Not sure yet if I want to run that added radius arm that goes forward or not.  I increased the width of the inner mounts to 16"  This was set up with 0* camber and 0* toe.

A question regarding non-plunging CV's.  I've heard different measurements.  Seems like the non plunging units are 1/8" to 1/4" narrower than the plunging counterparts?
Hell, I may just order one up to mock things up with.  So far, i'm planning on taking the pivot points of the upper and lower straight through the middle of the CV.

One last question.  Heim joints or bushings at the outer pivot?  Pros and cons? 

OUCH!
(https://i.imgur.com/b1pwx9P.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 10, 2018, 05:57:45 AM
You guys,  LMAO LMAO LMAO

Be sure ya leave enough room for the turbo and header in front, cause that will be next step.  Like drugs, little bit is a blast first time, then more more more more!!!!

I've got 7" from the header to the firewall of the chassis for a turbski location.
 8)

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on December 10, 2018, 08:45:51 AM
That should work.  Yes a little narrower, 1/8" sounds about right.  You will want to use cv boot flanges with over cv type boots to get the angle you desire.  The flanges will require work, to allow cv balls to slip thru.  I did have luck with boot staying on smooth cv, maybe others did.  I use boots from front of the ford f150 think its 02 but same as the stub axles I run on outside of car. 

This should rip!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 10, 2018, 08:54:48 AM
def want the radius rod forward! heims on all ends for sustainability for sure! always put the pivot through the center and 1/8" narrower but order 6 up ( always want a spare or two) and get it done!!  ;D ;D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 10, 2018, 09:11:26 AM
btw......it is my personal opinion that 35* is prob the max down angle you want to go. that requires a considerable clearencing of the over the cv boot retainer. like carl said the f150 boots are great on the NP 930's. now on that forward radius rod......imo climb half way up the front side lower a arm, weld it to the arm with heim mounted on frame. draw a line from the center of the axle at the cv pivot ,at a 45* angle back to the frame for the mount point. where it welds to the lower a arm, weld a tube from there to the rear leg of that arm.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 10, 2018, 09:13:14 AM
Nothing at all wrong with delrin bushings. For that matter,I'm in favor of their use wherever possible such as inner pivots of the arms.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 11, 2018, 07:13:10 AM
All valid points.
Iv'e had good luck with delrin on the inner pivots.  I didn't know if having heim joints and a little means of adjustment for toe and camber would possibly mess up the plunge.  My OCD in making things complicated is to incorporate a tie rod for toe and using uniballs on the outer pivots.  Almost like a front upright? 

I will re calculate to 35* and re check my math too.  I've got to account for the 70 tooth pizza pan sprocket too.  That should be appx. 14" in diameter.  My 60 tooth is around 12-ish.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 11, 2018, 08:39:04 AM
Delrin inner pivots and heims on outer as you describe is a good way to go IF you are inclined to actually do the adjustments to get the best handling. In the sand it will make little to no difference in how it is aligned in the rear but for dirt or hard pack it certainly will. If it ever hits pavement it will definitely be a bonus.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 11, 2018, 11:16:21 AM
username enemy has an a arm rear end with tie rod. he has a turbo busa with jeffco rev unit in it as well.

delrin is a very good choice and still doable on the bottom for sure. if you used heims on the upper ( frame side) then you could still make a very minor adjustment. so why not use a 2" longer axle with 35* down angle?? i ran 28" axle on my turbo busa. enemy does too and carlriddle as well.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 11, 2018, 12:18:33 PM
If you use a 3 point attachment to the hub carrier,one top and 2 bottom ,you can still run bushings inboard top and bottom and still have toe and camber adjustment. Lots of ways to do it. Pick your poison.

I guess I hadn't paid enough attention to enemy's a arms. I wasn't aware of his having a radius rod . Honestly,I'd widen the inner pivot points and ditch the radius rod. I have had zero issues with that. Plenty strong.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 11, 2018, 12:24:08 PM
As a side note,I have snagged the same tree in the trails twice now,at probably 30 mph . Both times it instantly stopped me ,slamming myself and my passenger into the belts rather abruptly  ;) . First time I bent the mid board hub carrier and I had 4 heim attachment. Second time nothing bent  but the bolts that attach the mid board hub to the carrier pulled about 1/2 of the threads out of the hub and that was with the 3 heim arrangement as I described above. Neither time did the a arms bend or tweak the frame attechment points. IMO,no need for a radius rod unless the frame attachment points are too close together.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on December 12, 2018, 05:35:56 PM
If you use a 3 point attachment to the hub carrier,one top and 2 bottom ,you can still run bushings inboard top and bottom and still have toe and camber adjustment. Lots of ways to do it. Pick your poison.

I guess I hadn't paid enough attention to enemy's a arms. I wasn't aware of his having a radius rod . Honestly,I'd widen the inner pivot points and ditch the radius rod. I have had zero issues with that. Plenty strong.

as long as those arms go into the carrier straight then yes that would work. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on December 26, 2018, 11:14:40 AM
So, after my highly technical "CAD" modeling, I have the center section drawn up, I've drawn up the full suspension cycle using a 24" axle pivot, 24" pivot points on my arms, 10" spread I was able to get just shy of 20" of travel with 38* of angle.  The below drawing is the front bulkhead section.  As you can see the notches for the chain clearance.  The rear bulkhead will have those omitted.  I will use the same means of adjustment as the AR had. 
(https://i.imgur.com/KPY1BNN.jpg?1)

I literally drew the entire back half of the car.  I even "modeled" where the front sprocket will be so I could see where the chain will go through the bulkhead.  I also got the points where the back of the engine will be mounted.  The mid rail of the car will be adjusted a little so the lines of the car will match the new back half.  I even mocked up the chassis shock location too!  I will be using the 12" stroke shocks I have and I have a 1.66 to 1 motion ratio.  The lower rear arms have been mocked up as well.  I had to make sure the CV will clear the arms at full droop.  It's tight, but it looks like it will work out! 
(https://i.imgur.com/IGbBm0m.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/GmLRw5g.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/diVs2JO.jpg)

I think I will be buying steel and water cutting tomorrow and friday!

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on December 26, 2018, 07:53:57 PM
Nice job. Nuttin' beats good planning.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on January 02, 2019, 06:39:22 AM
Well, I done messed up....
So, my vertical spread on my inner center section is 10".  In theory this is fine, however when the center of your axle is 3.5" above the bottom pivot, the upright will not fit into the 14" wheel.... or a 15" wheel......  I found this minor detail after the center section is all tacked together.
Well shit.  I will have the vertical spread at 8" now.  I KNOW this will work as I drew up some templates and mocked things up. 
I should have looked at this a long time ago. 

I have the new drawings made up as well as motor mounts now.  One step back, but now I can go 3 steps ahead of that.....after I get back from Philly.

Here is a large piece of scrap.  HAA  I can re use the tubes though.  This Sunday I should have the new center tacked up with the motor mounts in place.  The new design will be a little better in the long run too.
(https://i.imgur.com/BzkVewH.jpg)
 (https://i.imgur.com/81pECZj.jpg)
 (https://i.imgur.com/w2lYZpB.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on January 02, 2019, 06:52:21 AM
well that just happens sometimes and that's why we buy extra for our projects lol.  you need it done in time for the spring trip so no problem right lol
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on January 02, 2019, 06:58:20 AM
Edison said"I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work."
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on January 02, 2019, 07:07:47 AM
I like/believe these too:  Henry Ford “Anyone who stops learning is old, whether at twenty or eighty.Anyone who keeps learning stays young.”  “Failure is simply the opportunity to begin again, this time more intelligently.”
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on January 02, 2019, 07:24:18 AM
Yep, I’ve got plenty of steel to remake what I need. 
With the new design, I am able to capture the back of the pivot tabs as well as lighten the motor mounts.  Sometimes it’s good to mess up as there is always a better way to get things done. 
 Next spring trip probably won’t happen.  Just too much going on.

Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on January 03, 2019, 06:11:12 AM
Practice makes perfect.  I'm getting almost perfect with my list of do overs. LOL

Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on January 07, 2019, 04:54:13 AM
Well after my bottom lip stopped shaking and I wiped my tears away(insert image of a 4 yr old that lost a toy), I got some stuff done.

I re drew my inner bulkhead section, re drew my inner capture plates, drew my rear uprights and also cut said parts.  I ended up with an 8" vertical spread between my arms.  My upright clears the inside of my wheels and we are back on track!

Yesterday I got it all tacked up as well as actually attached to the chassis!  Next up is to build the new mid rail section for the back.  This will take me cutting more of the original chassis.  Where the "B" pillar attaches to the mid rail is where that will get cut and a new section that is longer and wider will meet the new vertical tubes on the bulkhead.

 (https://i.imgur.com/l58dxbS.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/VOKcdFR.jpg)
If you close one eye and squint really hard, you can kinda see how much longer the new chassis section is compared to the original. You can also see the clamped on piece of new 1.5" square as that is how far that new section will be coming back.
(https://i.imgur.com/OdezQ2L.jpg)

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on January 07, 2019, 05:19:15 AM
I used a similar rear spool design with the G&G spline shaft.  I twisted the first shaft and had to upgrade to a heat treated one.  Running a zx12.  Id check to see if HT was done, Rick doesnt say on his site.  Small price for the added durability. 

Upgrade looks great, looking like 10-12" added to length??
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on January 07, 2019, 05:39:05 AM
I used a similar rear spool design with the G&G spline shaft.  I twisted the first shaft and had to upgrade to a heat treated one.  Running a zx12.  Id check to see if HT was done, Rick doesnt say on his site.  Small price for the added durability. 

Upgrade looks great, looking like 10-12" added to length??
The wheelbase is 12" longer.  Good eye.  It will also be 6" overall wider too.
I will look into what Rick uses for shaft material.  Would it be better to cryo treat it vs heat treat?  I may have to look into that.
What does your car weigh?  I think I will be near 1200# with me in it after i'm done.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on January 07, 2019, 06:00:59 AM
Cryo does not replace heat treating. It is an additional step . In your case (and 99% of all cases) HT is all that is needed. Best shaft material would be 8620 but 4340 is just fine also.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on January 07, 2019, 07:14:46 AM
Cryo does not replace heat treating. It is an additional step . In your case (and 99% of all cases) HT is all that is needed. Best shaft material would be 8620 but 4340 is just fine also.
Good point.

Could I heat treat the existing spool I already have?  It seems it's still good.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on January 07, 2019, 07:28:57 AM
Not all steel is heat treatable. Do you know what it is made from?  Not all steels HT the same way either. The 8620 I referred to will not through harden leaving a hardened surface and a ductile core. The 4340 is through hardenable. Either will work well (and some others)but the composition needs known for the treater to be able to properly HT the item.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on January 07, 2019, 07:46:24 AM
I used a similar rear spool design with the G&G spline shaft.  I twisted the first shaft and had to upgrade to a heat treated one.  Running a zx12.  Id check to see if HT was done, Rick doesnt say on his site.  Small price for the added durability. 

Upgrade looks great, looking like 10-12" added to length??


i remember when you twisted that shaft. not a little twist and i remember looking at that shaft and noticing it was the same shape and spline of an ag shaft i have seen many times on several pto's!  you were n/a then and i bet you rail weighs 1000 to 1100lbs.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on January 07, 2019, 07:47:08 AM
deranged, is there no lip on that drive flange to capture the cv if the bolts were to loosen up?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on January 07, 2019, 10:13:38 AM
No sir, no lip.  I do check them before every trip though. 

That shaft is a G&G 21 spline shaft.  Model# 112A2221.  There is no spec on material type.  I may have to contact G&G to get that info so see if I can even heat treat it.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on January 07, 2019, 06:25:57 PM
No sir, no lip.  I do check them before every trip though. 

That shaft is a G&G 21 spline shaft.  Model# 112A2221.  There is no spec on material type.  I may have to contact G&G to get that info so see if I can even heat treat it.

Justin
Yup.That's the first thing.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on January 08, 2019, 02:55:30 AM
Mine is g&g 21 fully splined. Or it was before I sold the that spool. I bought from Jody at protodie he had it heat treated. Seems like about $50?  It looked new when I pulled out of car.  Car was 1125 but was back when was a 3 seater. I shaved some weight when I carved it but prob still close after turbo stuff. Rpm box about same weight as spool.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on January 08, 2019, 10:56:32 AM
 i see on  g&g's site that the splined shafting is offered in   1045, 1144 and 4140. if protodie were smart , then they ordered all 4140. i bet there ordering it in 1045 as thats rated for high tq on ag equipment. the part people fail to understand when looking at ag tq #'s is thats all lower rpm.  to put this in perspective for those that have never driven a tractor......1500 rpm on a pto is pretty high rpm on the crank of an older diesel tractor. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on January 08, 2019, 11:01:57 AM
so larry short of short sand cars used to have a custom shaft made that was a  1.25" od, 10 splined but missing 1 spline. this was because he used a 4 link rear end with u joints and he used the u joints off the late 60's 2wd chevy's with 2 pice drive shafts. they had a dead spline to line them up. when i started building way back i bought the shafts from larry's supplier, zimmerman machine in utah. the shafts were 4130 hardened and no one ever broke those. now the custom stub axles he used that were quadzilla size shafts to run quadzilla hubs, were through hardened and he ran 12" dia wheels. those shaft were 1045 like most production car axles , then hardened. his stubs were 50/50 if they lasted lol
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on January 08, 2019, 08:46:24 PM
105F2221 1-3/8 x 21 

http://www.ggmfg.com/Products/Adaptors/Splined-Shafts
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on January 15, 2019, 05:04:30 AM
Back at it! 
Not much for visual, but all the little stuff like delrin bushings, pivot tubes for the rear suspension, weld bushings and parts.

I did cut the B-pillar off to extend the mid rail to the new center section.  Turned out great!  I only had to pull out the ratchet strap once to pull the original chassis back to my center line. 

I will be buying this radiator.  It will fit perfectly between the new roll cage.  I think I will run an nice big 16" fan that pulls 2300 CFM.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/3ROW-Core-RADIATOR-For-Chevy-Impala-Chevelle-EL-Camino-I6-V8-1964-1968-Aluminum/252165657107?fits=Model%3AChevelle&epid=0&hash=item3ab63e9213:g:bnkAAOSwE0JY~ais:rk:2:pf:1&frcectupt=true

I mocked up the roll bar hoop with a piece of PVC I had laying around and I like it!  I will make a complete hoop that ties back into the mid rail up front.
The diagonal that (yellow tape) goes up and back to the new center section will be removable to get the ole big-block into the chassis.

The seat is also back 3" and up 2.5" which improves the feel of the seating.  This will also give more room for my under seat/speaker box slash fuel cell.

(https://i.imgur.com/vYQNLIL.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on January 15, 2019, 09:35:43 AM
LOOKS GOOD,NICE WORK!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: jersdunz on January 15, 2019, 11:15:59 AM
Whenever I see projects like these my brain jumps straight to the question..
Wouldn't it be better to build a whole new buggy so the SideXSide Comparison of the changes can be done in real time in the Sand..

Put this one back together and build another FOR SCIENCE!!

FOR SCIENCE!!!
https://www.garrettmotion.com/racing-and-performance/performance-catalog/turbo/gt2860rs/ (https://www.garrettmotion.com/racing-and-performance/performance-catalog/turbo/gt2860rs/)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on January 16, 2019, 04:46:10 AM
Thanks fellas!

HAA  yeah, I contemplated just starting over, but i will save that for another build. 

I DO like that turbo you linked me too.  Gonna keep it NA for this year and MAYBE turbo it next winter.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on January 23, 2019, 07:18:27 AM
leave it n/a and turbo the ap build you have coming down the pipe!  ;) ;D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on February 13, 2019, 04:36:15 AM
Not much time as of lately spent on the car.  Business travels have kept me pretty busy.  BUT, I have the back of the car all tacked together!  I kinda like how it turned out.  It really isn't too structurally important, so I did a miter cut at the bottom. Still some more bracing to add, but i'm getting there.  If you look at the pictures, I will have a dead tube where the roll cage attaches to the rear of the chassis, so iv'e got to sort that out once I get the cage in place.  A heavy 1/16" gap at the bottom, i will take that.  I just ordered my 1.5" and 2.6" stainless exhaust parts, some cool 1.5" to 3" stainless steel cones that a company out of Michigan makes for my exhaust sizing transitions, a Magnaflow muffler, v band clamps, a Walbro external fuel pump, Aeromotive FPR, a 22"x 19" radiator, aluminum shroud and a Spal 16" fan.  I have also machined all of my delrin bushings, crush sleeves and have everything cut and bent for my lower rear arms.  Next week I am sending some tubing off to Griffen Fabworks to get rolled for my roll cage.  Iv'e gotta get moving!!
(https://i.imgur.com/VIQfbZp.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/IvFOIsJ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/rVf990e.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/9gfG8QQ.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on February 13, 2019, 08:16:49 AM
looks good! what do you mean, send off tube to get it rolled for the roll cage? a tube roller vs a tube bender?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on March 18, 2019, 05:20:04 AM
Good lord, being busy and partially lazy in the winter sucks.  HAA!! 

I have been making progress though. 
I fit up my lower arms to see how things look when in full droop.  I wanted to see the clearance around the CV in full droop as well as locate my shock mounting points. 
I have 19" of travel with 5" under the chassis at full bump, and 39* of CV angle.  I will be ordering my inner CV's and axles to make sure things are rotating as they should.  I mocked up my shock location to verify and things are landing as planned.  Shock angle at full bump is a touch off 90* and I can live with that.
(https://i.imgur.com/s7vRGVc.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/Myr1UhJ.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/zR8L5oB.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/ubhpIY1.jpg)

I also got the engine and exhaust fit up.  V-band clamps are freaking AWESOME!  I like the center exit exhaust, however it takes up a lot of useful space for things like fuel tank, radiator in the wing...  So I am thinking of other alternatives.  Possibly run the muffler vertical behind the engine and bull horn off and have the exhaust exit on each side of the chassis.
One thing I did also was got rid of the miter joint on the bottom rear of the chassis.
 (https://i.imgur.com/iPPy5HE.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/74MLPLV.jpg)

Thoughts on a fuel cell next to the muffler? Above the muffler?  I would make a tunnel of sorts and insulate it to keep as much heat away as possible.
(https://i.imgur.com/EVQ2tDh.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on March 18, 2019, 10:00:10 AM
Run the exhaust under the sprocket carrier would be sweeter. Looks good BTW!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: budlight69 on March 18, 2019, 03:48:02 PM
Looks good.  Did you build or buy the outboard rear bearing carrier?  I agree with fabr on the exhaust if it fits.  Add a some insulation and heat shield.  Bring it down to the dunes in 6 weeks and we'll just finish it up there ;D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 18, 2019, 05:36:51 PM
it does look good! so exh placement is up to you and either way i believe it will work. if you bottom out from time to time inderneath the carrier will require a skid plate. i will say i have tried the 90* back to back turns in the exh and it does add back pressure. how much ....i really cannot say but i went back to under the carrier myself ( n/a busa) i still have the factory header i modified and ran 3 plus years that i merged 4 into one at the factory Y or crossover section. i would've gave it to you can still will if you want an extra. i like the carriers btw. what else are you going to do to the lower arms where the shock mounts? that bend is a weak point now imo and may need to make a slightly beefier shock mount.  maybe something like this??


Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 18, 2019, 05:40:50 PM
i am still waiting for my new turbo manifold before i can start my swap over to the efr 6758 turbo. enemy also bought the efr 6258 for his busa so this will be a nice test in case you ever decide to boost yours.  ;D ;)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Lance-W on March 18, 2019, 08:41:57 PM
Sorry about being negative but I learned this the hard way.

I would be concerned with how your mounting loading that bottom arm with that shock.  It's in the middle of the span, off center forward to back, it's going to twist that arm like a pretzel.
 
Think about it this way.  The inner arm pivot points are fixed vertically and the wheel lugs/flange are fixed vertically,  The shock is a hydraulic press pushing down and what happens.............  I really don't think you can make that arm strong enough and with enough cross bracing to allow it to survive.  Even if you were able to make it strong enough not to bend you'll never solve the twist problem.


(https://i.imgur.com/ubhpIY1.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on March 19, 2019, 05:29:53 AM
GREAT info! 
For the exhaust routing.  Below my spool on those brackets there is webbing in there that rests on the horizontal tube.  It takes some stress off the bolts holding the spool in place.

As for the arms.  I totally agree that having the shock in the middle of a bend is bad.  I will have a truss on that arm to spread out the load.

Lance, not negative at all.  That is constructive criticism to fill in my design shortcomings that i welcome very much!
Good eye on the twisting affect.  I will have a bypass shock on the other arm.  I thing that would spread the twist out?  I do have the ability to push the shocks into the center of the arm and build some plate work between the arms so that the loading will be more central to the pivot points.  I just have to clear my axle running in between the coil over and the bypass.

Looks as if I need to get the cv's and axles in place to line this out.

Justin 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on March 19, 2019, 05:31:28 AM
I got my uppers tacked together for fitment...I couldn't help myself to put a wheel on.  SO STOKED on how it looks!

(https://i.imgur.com/HDUVCx8.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/zTxhj3y.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 19, 2019, 12:12:48 PM
40* might be a bit extreme on those cv's. i ran mine with a max of 35* on my busa for 3 years. it does run higher temps at 35* where 40* will be a touch hotter. i have never tried 40* so i cannot say for sure. i lowered mine to 30* with my current motor. only thing getting them hot now is my down pipe lol
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 19, 2019, 12:24:27 PM
lance is right on the twist as well as bending moment.      just for example.......enemy had lower a arms with a single piece made out of 1.5" od .25" wall 1020 dom. i mounted the shock close to center as you have done. i questioned if that 1\4" wall was strong enough waaaaaay back then! lol it wasn't, he bent it down apprx 1/8". so built new ones  with a brace. now you have seen my current rear a arms with 2.5 fox shock mounted 40% up from carrier. i used 1 piece of 1.5" od .25 wall tube and 1.25" od .120 wall to make the lowers. recangle 1"x2" .125 wall tube was used as bracing. shock is mounted on the 1.5" tube with an extra wide ( 8" wide i think) shock mounts. the rectangle tube welds to the point to take the twisting moment.  i say all this because mine is much heavier than yours. it has been fine for over 2 years and has been bottomed out a couple times. now having said that i also have a 3 legged lower arm so the twisting moment is support from both sides. could a couple pieces of rectangle tube in each lower for bracing work on your with current shock location?? i think so if you use a long/wide shock tab that spans ateast 3/4 of the lower arm and inner tab weld to the recangle.  still cannot say for sure though.    lancew what are you thoughts on that idea?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on March 19, 2019, 01:01:36 PM
40* might be a bit extreme on those cv's. i ran mine with a max of 35* on my busa for 3 years. it does run higher temps at 35* where 40* will be a touch hotter. i have never tried 40* so i cannot say for sure. i lowered mine to 30* with my current motor. only thing getting them hot now is my down pipe lol

I will tone it down on the angle.  I will max it out at 35* to keep things somewhat in the safe zone.  Maybe 36* to live life on the edge.  LOL

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on March 19, 2019, 01:08:48 PM
lance is right on the twist as well as bending moment.      just for example.......enemy had lower a arms with a single piece made out of 1.5" od .25" wall 1020 dom. i mounted the shock close to center as you have done. i questioned if that 1\4" wall was strong enough waaaaaay back then! lol it wasn't, he bent it down apprx 1/8". so built new ones  with a brace. now you have seen my current rear a arms with 2.5 fox shock mounted 40% up from carrier. i used 1 piece of 1.5" od .25 wall tube and 1.25" od .120 wall to make the lowers. recangle 1"x2" .125 wall tube was used as bracing. shock is mounted on the 1.5" tube with an extra wide ( 8" wide i think) shock mounts. the rectangle tube welds to the point to take the twisting moment.  i say all this because mine is much heavier than yours. it has been fine for over 2 years and has been bottomed out a couple times. now having said that i also have a 3 legged lower arm so the twisting moment is support from both sides. could a couple pieces of rectangle tube in each lower for bracing work on your with current shock location?? i think so if you use a long/wide shock tab that spans ateast 3/4 of the lower arm and inner tab weld to the recangle.  still cannot say for sure though.    lancew what are you thoughts on that idea?

Below is a side view of the lower arm that shows the trusset (gusset that reminds me of a truss) that will span appx 70% of the arm.  It will be boxed and have a boss on each side for the  lower shock bolt.
(https://i.imgur.com/dpie4hZ.jpg)
After these discussions, i may be able to move everything towards the center.  I will have to mock in an axle to check clearances.  Very similar to the front lower arm on an a-arm prerunner set up.
Below is a plan view of the lower arm.  The outer x in red is the proposed  shock location.  If there is room, I may move things closer to the center and box things in.  Thoughts?
(https://i.imgur.com/m1TnIMA.jpg)
   
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 19, 2019, 03:58:18 PM
40* might be a bit extreme on those cv's. i ran mine with a max of 35* on my busa for 3 years. it does run higher temps at 35* where 40* will be a touch hotter. i have never tried 40* so i cannot say for sure. i lowered mine to 30* with my current motor. only thing getting them hot now is my down pipe lol

I will tone it down on the angle.  I will max it out at 35* to keep things somewhat in the safe zone.  Maybe 36* to live life on the edge.  LOL

Justin

 ;) ;D

the pic of your truss idea for a-arms looks good. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Lance-W on March 19, 2019, 07:58:39 PM
It'll just bend at the end of the truss.   You're just moving the stress point.  To overcome it with a truss the truss has to go from one reaction (think pivot) point to the other.  At which point why even use the tube other than be a jig for the truss.  The shock in the middle of the arm is the problem......

Putting the shock on one side and the bypass on the other is a good idea to balance the load but the arm will still see twist if they are not even in the reaction force when the arm is forced up in suspension compression.  Whether it's close enough???  all you can do is try it.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on March 19, 2019, 08:59:07 PM
It'll just bend at the end of the truss.   You're just moving the stress point.  To overcome it with a truss the truss has to go from one reaction (think pivot) point to the other.  At which point why even use the tube other than be a jig for the truss.  The shock in the middle of the arm is the problem......

Putting the shock on one side and the bypass on the other is a good idea to balance the load but the arm will still see twist if they are not even in the reaction force when the arm is forced up in suspension compression.  Whether it's close enough???  all you can do is try it.
I agree with that.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on March 20, 2019, 04:56:46 AM
That makes perfect sense.  I went back and reviewed pictures of other a-arm suspensions and the truss goes all the way to the reaction point.  I will use these arms for set up and I think I will build a set of boxed plate lowers.  I would rather be safe than sorry.

I appreciate the info! 

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 20, 2019, 06:46:18 AM
the stretched rear section really does change the overall look, i do like it.  the boxed and plated lowers is probably the best idea.  what bolt pattern are those rear hubs?
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on March 20, 2019, 08:40:25 AM
The rear hubs are a 5 on 4.5.  I have adapters to run the 4 on 156 bolt pattern RZR wheels.

Here is a booty shot.
(https://i.imgur.com/a92XtLB.jpg)

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 20, 2019, 09:03:12 AM
you sure have a thing for booty shots  rofl    looks good. stu 1300ns? 8.80 razors in the front??  :D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on March 21, 2019, 06:56:30 AM
GOnna look killer when done!Turbo the thing and you will have no problem running with most of the big(hp) cars.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on March 21, 2019, 07:05:27 AM
Turbo it to around 300 safe HP. What's your car weigh? Maybe 7-800 pounds? Using 800 pounds and 300 HP makes itapprox 2.7 pounds per HP(OR 700 pound car would be just 2.3 pounds per hP). Consider a 3500 pound car with twin turbo'd v-8 making approx 1200 HP.That would be 2.9 pounds per HP. The smaller car wins out!!! GO for it!

 I was watching some vids of the HP Wars in Glamis a couple years ago. The TomPro turbo busa car was barely,just barely,being out run by the really big HP dogs. You know,the 2000+HP guys. Honestly why pay $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ for a big HP car when you can have the same perf for $$ with a busa?????? The ONLY thing the big cars can do better is hammer the terrain when a small car can't.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 21, 2019, 08:01:02 AM
what he said ^^^  :D


fabr , did i tell you while talking to carl it dawned on me what was wrong with my busa engne all that time??   


i case i did not, ( still a bit painful to talk about lol ) so in a nutshell i forgot to re caliberate my gear position switch in bazzaz.  as you well know and i'm sure others know, the stock ecu has gear specific fuel/timing maps for set tps or map readings. N has its own fuel/timing map. part of a big push back when was a resistor that went inline with the gps ( gear pos sensor) to tell it that it was 5 gear to cancel the speed limiter plus more power in lower gears depending  etc etc .   so bazzaz has some default setting that isnt correct and i saw that before i shipped mine back.  it had a couple bad connections and bazzaz there there was an issue in a couple runs of harness's. i forgot to recaliberate it when i got it back. basically i was stuck in N map for most of the gears.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on March 21, 2019, 11:54:23 AM
We all have brain farts once in a while.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Grimm Reaper Racing on March 21, 2019, 02:32:22 PM
 5: Brian, you needed an ATRE... Advanced Timing Retard Eliminator.  I use the Healtech digital gear indicator that has one built in. Works very nicely.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 21, 2019, 03:23:07 PM
had one, never used it. that was why bazzaz allowed access to the gear position inputs. that TRE you speak of, for a busa basically tells the ecu it's in 5th gear for max full power and removes electronic speed restriction. the difference is you can set 1st and 2nd or how ever many as stock then set 3rd or 4th and up as 5th.  all as 5th if you wanted to, what ever you want. i thought i had set it and didn't. didn't remember that until i was talking to carl.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 21, 2019, 03:23:31 PM
We all have brain farts once in a while.

yes we do but that's a pretty big one  ;)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on March 21, 2019, 06:55:22 PM
The more we know,the more we can overlook and the farts just keep getting bigger. 
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 22, 2019, 07:14:43 AM
george carlin?   :D
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on March 22, 2019, 09:45:03 AM
Nope but George and I pretty much agree on things. I miss George. Can you imagine how his truth comedy would go over today? The shit would hit the fan for sure.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on March 23, 2019, 08:39:01 AM
george carlin and mel brooks should've gotten together to make a movie  ;) ;D rofl
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on March 23, 2019, 12:55:41 PM
Throw in Don Rickles and you have a PC disaster. I would have LOVED it for sure. Add a bit of Rodney Dangerfield and I'd still be laughing. That reminds me I saw Up In Smoke the other day. :m
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on March 26, 2019, 10:45:52 AM
you sure have a thing for booty shots  rofl    looks good. stu 1300ns? 8.80 razors in the front??  :D
lol!!!  i ALWAYS LIKE A GOOD BOOTY SHOT!!

You are spot on with the sizing!

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on March 26, 2019, 10:47:55 AM
Turbo it to around 300 safe HP. What's your car weigh? Maybe 7-800 pounds? Using 800 pounds and 300 HP makes itapprox 2.7 pounds per HP(OR 700 pound car would be just 2.3 pounds per hP). Consider a 3500 pound car with twin turbo'd v-8 making approx 1200 HP.That would be 2.9 pounds per HP. The smaller car wins out!!! GO for it!

 I was watching some vids of the HP Wars in Glamis a couple years ago. The TomPro turbo busa car was barely,just barely,being out run by the really big HP dogs. You know,the 2000+HP guys. Honestly why pay $$$$$$$$$$$$$$ for a big HP car when you can have the same perf for $$ with a busa?????? The ONLY thing the big cars can do better is hammer the terrain when a small car can't.

For this year it will be NA, and next winter will be time for a turbo.  I think the car will weigh 1200 with me in it. 
Oh, the power to weight ratio is awesome!  That's why I like the small cars so stinking much.

Justin
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 10, 2019, 04:52:46 AM
CAGE!  Finally I took a day off in the middle of the week to where there was no distractions to deal with.  It was 60*, no kids, no wife, just me and the garage.
I had my buddy at Griffen Fabworks roll my cage hoop.  I gave them extra material on each end to work with and man, i'm glad I did.  My initial thought was to have the back tube land in between the upper coilover mount and the upper bypass mount but when I set the tube up in place, I really liked how it looked all the way to the back of the car.  So 8 hours later I had this!
I will be adding 2 bars that will go from the A-pilar to the nose of the car.  They will have a 40* or so bend close to the nose.  That is this weekends plan, as well as the last motor mounts.

(https://i.imgur.com/kJdqKPh.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/DFrqajL.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/usV2DfK.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on April 10, 2019, 06:49:53 AM
i like it! completely changes the look!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: big dave on April 10, 2019, 07:49:22 AM
looks great. I like it going all the way to the back as well.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on April 10, 2019, 09:15:06 AM
Looks really good .I like it. 8)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: deranged on April 15, 2019, 06:02:09 AM
Thanks guys!

Again, more garage time. 
I got some more steel for the front of the car.  Proportionately it needed some more to it.  I think it turned out looking pretty cool.  The new dash bar is the same height as the sheet metal kicker I had on my old hood piece so my visibility will be the same, actually better as my seat is up an inch and a half. 

I got some really light 3/4"-ish tubing that i bent up so that the aluminum side panels had somewhere to bolt to.  Seems I will be getting in and out of the car, I would probably bend the panels if there was nothing there. 

I started to layout the sheet metal panels in poster board.  So far, I am liking what i'm seeing.   I made a firewall of sorts on the bulkhead behind the engine.  I will line it with some sort of heat resistant material.  Probably some of that Boom Mat, as that worked really good on my last set up.  The fuel cell will be in that open area behind the engine.  I think I calculated it to be around 7 gallons.

(https://i.imgur.com/Vtrck2n.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/AtkwQ38.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/7GsPvAq.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/vaLFrJ7.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/8AcuuoO.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/xjxIsJ7.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/AQP8r24.jpg)
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: big dave on April 15, 2019, 06:05:44 AM
Loving the new look. looks fast just seating there.
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: fabr on April 15, 2019, 06:52:55 AM
Gonna be killer looking!!!!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: dsrace on April 15, 2019, 03:41:20 PM
i really like that! whole new machine!
Title: Re: AR-51 build
Post by: Carlriddle on April 15, 2019, 04:34:57 PM
Really looking good!!
Glad to see someone w more work than me if we gonna make this trip lol