DTSFab.com (Desert, Trail and Sand)
The Machine Shop => Welding/Cutting/Bending/Forming => Topic started by: phelpsracing1 on December 31, 2008, 11:17:26 AM
-
I'm looking to get a new metal chop saw and I need some information. I have a Dewalt abrasive chop saw now but it throws sparks everywhere and leaves that black dust everywhere. I have been looking at the new cold cut saws and was wondering if anyone has one or used one extensively? Dewalt, Milwaukee, and Makita all make their version as well as Dake and other industrial companies. I have heard they cut 10 times faster than the old abrasive chop saws, throw no sparks, and more cost efficient, but have to be used very carefully not break the carbide teeth on the $100 plus blades. Tell me your opinions....
-
Here is the Dewalt DW872
-
Just bought an Evolution.I love it so far. Much faster/cleaner.
-
Have you broken any blades?
-
No and properly used you won't.If you have employees you will.
-
Definitely the way to go for miter cuts on tubing.
-
I used an older Bocsh that ran coolant on the blade, The guy selling it said it was only the second blde since he had it, He was a dock builder...So lots of mitre cuts...I'd own it except it was 3 phase...
I used a hand held one... Looks like a big skilsaw, It breezed thru 3/16 plate pretty smoothly, Nice thing about them is the small amount of mess and burr's
-
Yea thats what I'm afraid of.... other people using the saw while I have to foot the bill for the new blades. What is the proper technique for using these saws? I have heard that you apply almost no pressure on the blade while cutting or it will ruin the teeth
-
Nope NO PRESSURE they self feed
-
Do they make more noise or about the same as an abrasive chop saw?
-
less noise, and not shit for sparks.....
BUT DON'T LET THAT FOOL YOU
a guy at work walked up and said hey that's cool and picked up a hanfull of chips fresh out of the saw...Blisters resulted...and I giggled my little mean ass off ;D
-
We have been using a cold saw for years. It is the ticket for smaller sizes, and miter cuts. We run coolant on ours. We have our blades sharpened, so that reduces the cost some.
It loves tubing or smaller bars 1/4" and 1/2". We always cut it the short way, (stand up the bar) so the blade is contacting the 1/2" width, and it will go right through 1/2 x 4. If I have to cut a 1x4, I take it to the bandsaw....
Definately less noise than an abrasize saw..... no comparison.
It doesn't take much pressure, till you start cutting wide. It will smoke down thru a 3x3x1/4" tube, till you hit the bottom, and it is cutting clear across the 3". Then it slows down and you have to apply some pressure. Not that it isn't doing a good job, it is just contacting more material with more teeth.
-
The blade mfg's suggest putting square or angle stock in so that no side lays flat in the saw.Keeps the blade cutting through a thinner cross section. Much more effecient.
-
WIth alum solid stock-USE COOLANT OR CUTTING FLUID
-
Lot's of it :o
or just get the aluminum blade
-
I run a Milwaukee. You can get the blades chryofreezed and they last longer, there are also places that will replace missing teeth for a couple bucks per tooth, but i'm too lazy and just order new ones. I have a stack of blades I won't trow out, just gonna drop them off somewhere someday to get fixed/sharpened. I use the effin sh*t outta this thing.
I don't put all my weight on the saw, but I certainly don't baby it either, I just push at a comfortable rate. I removed one of the springs in the back so there is just enough tension to hold it where I want, that way I can set it on top of the tube for measuring, but it will stay up for sliding the tube through..
After using a few different produts and different suppliers, I have been using this blade http://www.maxtool.com/product/search.asp for the last 3 years and am very happy with it. Only $69 with free shipping, I buy 4 at a time and they last a while..........
-
These are only some of the used blades I have here, and I actually threw a ton of them away before I realized there were places that sharpened them, lol.....
-
Lot's of it :o
or just get the aluminum blade
Good point .There are blades for differing materials and stock thickness.
-
;D mm: ;D
-
I run a Milwaukee. You can get the blades chryofreezed and they last longer, there are also places that will replace missing teeth for a couple bucks per tooth, but i'm too lazy and just order new ones. I have a stack of blades I won't trow out, just gonna drop them off somewhere someday to get fixed/sharpened. I use the effin sh*t outta this thing.
I don't put all my weight on the saw, but I certainly don't baby it either, I just push at a comfortable rate. I removed one of the springs in the back so there is just enough tension to hold it where I want, that way I can set it on top of the tube for measuring, but it will stay up for sliding the tube through..
After using a few different produts and different suppliers, I have been using this blade http://www.maxtool.com/product/search.asp for the last 3 years and am very happy with it. Only $69 with free shipping, I buy 4 at a time and they last a while..........
Good Gawd! Yoshi is there anything you don't freeze? Do you cryo your Johnson to make it last longer also???? LOL!
-
HE HE HE HE HE
BRING THAT LITTLE SUCKER UP HERE AND HANG IT OUT...- 10 FOR THE HIGH TODAY, that'll freeze it for ya
Effen caps lock ;D
-
Good Gawd! Yoshi is there anything you don't freeze? Do you cryo your Johnson to make it last longer also???? LOL!
lol,...tell you what, send a couple common drill bits you go through and a blade down here, i'll have them frozen with my next batch of stuff and send em back, you'd be surprised at how much longer they last....
-
Thanks everyone for all the information. I tell you what, if you cant find out about something here on this site then you are probably just out of luck. Also yoshi, how do you like your Milwaukee? I have narrowed it down to either a Dewalt or the Milwaukee. Is the base flismy or is it made sturdy?
-
That's why we're here 8)
-
Thanks everyone for all the information. I tell you what, if you cant find out about something here on this site then you are probably just out of luck. Also yoshi, how do you like your Milwaukee? I have narrowed it down to either a Dewalt or the Milwaukee. Is the base flismy or is it made sturdy?
I effin love it, over 4 years of almost daily use and it's still good as new. The base is thick aluminum, not thin tin like every other one i've ever seen, it doesn't flex at all...
In 4 years i've had to replace the vise part twice (a lot of use with employees that put all their body weight into tightening the vice doesn't work out so well) , but they are so cheap I ordered 3 last time, I think they are around $16 apiece, I almost got into an argument with the guy on the phone when I ordered it, I kept saying "no, you don't understand, I need the entire vice assembly, not just a part of it" and he kept saying, "yes, that's the entire part, $16 dollars", I said, "no, I need the entire vice assembly man, your not hearing me", I just couldn't believe it was that cheap, I was all ready to shell out over $100 for something like that on a tool I paid well over $600 for. I ended up waiting a day to order it because I made him send me an email with a detailed pic of everything that was included, it was everything so I ordered it. If you get 3, it puts the price at a number that will get you free shipping I believe....
here's the part number for the saw, shop around, there are some good deals out there....milwaukee 6190-20...
And here's the part number and phone number where to order the vice direct to get the best price..
MILWAUKEE ELECTRIC TOOL..............................................262-781-3600
(clamp vise part number 45840120)
-
check into the evolution.Not knocking the Mil as it I'm sure well built but the Evo is well built and solid also.All castings,no tin.. I paid 279 I think about 6 months ago.
-
Best price I found so far was $408.99
http://www.epinions.com/review/Milwaukee_6190_20_15_Amp_14_Metal_Cutoff_Machine/content_449871842948 (http://www.epinions.com/review/Milwaukee_6190_20_15_Amp_14_Metal_Cutoff_Machine/content_449871842948)
-
here's a factory reconditioned for $349.95..
http://www.cpomilwaukee.com/grinders_and_metalworking/cutoff_machines/6190-80.html?ref=shopping6190-80 (http://www.cpomilwaukee.com/grinders_and_metalworking/cutoff_machines/6190-80.html?ref=shopping6190-80)
-
Yoshi,Steves Wholesale Tool is just down the road from you .When nearby you might stop in and checkout the EVO and tell me/us if it appears of comparable quality to the Mil. I know the Mils are of top quality but have not really checked them out for myself and am curious as to how the evo stacks up in your opinion. Our local weld supplier had them when the lower priced/consumer cold saws first came out and said they had no troubles with the Evo's. They were about 500 bux 5 years ago..
-
Yoshi,Steves Wholesale Tool is just down the road from you .When nearby you might stop in and checkout the EVO and tell me/us if it appears of comparable quality to the Mil.
i'll be out that way next week, i'll stop by and have a looksie...
-
What's the advantage of a cold cut saw over say an Ellis bandsaw? We had an Ellis at the college an I loved it. They aren't cheap, but I would think that at $100 a blade for the cold saw, an Ellis would make that up over years of use. (The Ellis had a rotatable head for miters and could be stood up for vertical use.)
-
About a thousand bux
-
I know that, but from the pile of blades that Yoshi has, I would think that price difference would be made up by now.
-
I know that, but from the pile of blades that Yoshi has, I would think that price difference would be made up by now.
My blades are $69 each shipped, and I can build quite a few chassis as well as cutting other materials before the blades get dull, and as said before, that pile of blades I have can always be sharpened for about $15 each.
I like fast dry cuts, I don't wanna have to dry off my tubing before I can use it, it's really a pain since the edges are sharp and there's always a little snag, and I don't like black clouds of smoke where I work either. For what I do for a living, the speed i'm able to cut with my saw outweighs any additional money I MAY be paying for blades after you figure in the fact they can be sharpened and reused a few times..........
-
when you guys started talking cold saws.. in my head i pictured a liquid cooled bandsaw.. then i seen the mitersaw lookin do-dad... so why are those called cold saws? does the blade move slower or what?
-
Not sure why they call them cold saws. They make a cut that almost looks like a mill cut.
The one I use in a Scotchman. It's 3 phase with coolant and only has 2 speeds. Slow and crawl. 30 rpm for 1/8" and up 60rpm for under 1/8" it does require some pressure and more as the blade wears. We also send them out for sharpening.
-
1450 rpm
-
They chip the metal they dont grind, Cold Saw....
-
1450 rpm?
-
1450 for the EVO.I think Milwaukee says 1500
-
Just out of curiosity and the lack of knowledge on cold saws, what would happen if you just put one of those blades on a regular chopsaw?
-
Just out of curiosity and the lack of knowledge on cold saws, what would happen if you just put one of those blades on a regular chopsaw?
the same thing that happens to a drill bit when you try to spin it too fast, it dulls the edges and won't cut....
-
You'd burn it up.
cold saws I've used are like 60 rpm tops.
-
1450 for what were talking about.The super low rpm stuff does a VERY nice cut.These are much faster and don't do as nice a cut but very good nonetheless and MUCH faster.BTW there are blades out there that CLAIN toi be able to run at 3600 or so but so far they have proved to be junk.
-
I had no idea what these saws are about until I saw this video. I want one.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnopNPgd-80 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnopNPgd-80)
-
I got a new blade for my chopsaw the other day and almost got one of those. Glad I didn't. Would have wasted it. Thank you guys. Good info. :)
-
i had no idea what these were all about either untill i seen that video.. thanks gene.
-
That guy has short wood.
-
It is my understanding that what most people in this post are referring to is a dry cut saw. I have both the Milwaukee and an evolution Rage dry cut saws at my personal shop, but no cold cut. Both are excellent machines. At work we have a cold cut, and that spins extremely slow and uses coolant. Am I mistaken or are we confusing some terminology.
-
It is my understanding that what most people in this post are referring to is a dry cut saw. I have both the Milwaukee and an evolution Rage dry cut saws at my personal shop, but no cold cut. Both are excellent machines. At work we have a cold cut, and that spins extremely slow and uses coolant. Am I mistaken or are we confusing some terminology.
I consider mine a slow cut, not a cold cut. A dry cut term would apply to my slower spinning carbide blade saw, and a fast chop saw (hot saw) blade, if you went by the dry term term.....
-
Yoshi, your avatar kills me. Funny stuff. ;D
If someone were to purchase a cold saw blade and put it on a dry cut machine would it work? I don't believe so. There is industry standard terminology to minimize confusion, that is all I was pointing out. I consider my dry cut machines to be hot shit, but that doesn't help me when I purchase blades for them.
Cold saw = slow + coolant
Dry cut saw = medium speed, no coolant
Abrasive chop saw = high speed + sparks good for lighting stuff on fire
-
It is my understanding that what most people in this post are referring to is a dry cut saw. I have both the Milwaukee and an evolution Rage dry cut saws at my personal shop, but no cold cut. Both are excellent machines. At work we have a cold cut, and that spins extremely slow and uses coolant. Am I mistaken or are we confusing some terminology.
How does the rage compare to the Milwaukee? I have had my rage for a short time and really like it. Have you seen any issues with it?
-
The Milwaukee is the 14" workhorse. The Evolution tools- Rage3 is the smaller 10" sliding miter version. I like the laser guide on the rage, and it's ability to cut compound angles has saved my ass a couple times. No issues with either. I use the Milwaukee 10x as much though.
-
Mine's a 14".I haven't used a MIL and am curious as to how they compare.
-
No expierience with these but I saw this and decided to share it off of OFN.
These are supposed to fit a "normal" chop saw. The abrasive wheel type that crank over 4000 RPM.
You make your own call on if they might work for you? I would imagine these on a dry cut saw at slower speeds (1300 rpm to 1500 rpm) these would last a long time. The price is right.
http://www.offroadfabnet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1628 (http://www.offroadfabnet.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1628)
Above is a link to OFN and the review. Below is a direct link to the page.
http://www.bulletindustries.com/Shop/Control/fp/scat/253320/SFV/32766/page/1/checkForLanding/true (http://www.bulletindustries.com/Shop/Control/fp/scat/253320/SFV/32766/page/1/checkForLanding/true)
-
The guys at OFN weren't very impressed with that at all the last time I looked at the thread.Is it still the concensus that they're not good?