DTSFab.com (Desert, Trail and Sand)
UTV's Off Road ( RZR, YXZ, Mini Buggy, Carts,etc.) => UTV Motor and Drivetrain => Topic started by: CrazyFastFab on June 21, 2014, 09:04:58 AM
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Is there a cheaper way to read the codes from the Hayabusa?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/280750392078?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT (http://www.ebay.com/itm/280750392078?_trksid=p2055119.m1438.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT)
I think I have the mess that was the wiring harness all cleaned up. I need to go thru it again but it doesn't seem to be showing signs of life. Power on and the gauges light up and cycle. The fuel pump doesn't pressure up. I could wire the pump to something else and turn it on that way but for now it is connected to the PCM.
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Just use the factory busa gauge cluster to pull codes.
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Thanks, just found the jump and definitions to do that.
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how did you wire the side stand switch? there is a supposed to be a diode ( it shows this in the suzuki wire diagram) in that connection. if that wire isn't right your fuel pump will not energize as well as a bad relay to the pump. otherwise you have a wire wrong. tip sensor also will shut off the fuel pump.
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+1
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Thanks, I bought this engine from another guy that had it in his buggy. I met him and saw it run in his car. We than pulled the engine and it set in my shop for two years while I built my car. SO it did get some hanger rash. Once I started wiring my car I have found several things wrong with the harness. I am convinced that he must have had times driving that the car such off while driving due to the mess that was the harness. A lot of butt connectors and extra plugs connected to plugs. Not saying mine looks any better but everything is soldered and marine heat shrinked.
To answer the question, brand new relay. I am only using one type of replay so that in the middle of no where I can move the relays around if needed. Knowing what I know about the rest of the harness I need to check the diode connections. I have check that the diode is installed.
Throttle inlet sensor (TIP) where is this sensor located? I don't readily see where the ECM would be picking that signal up. I redid the entire fuel system maybe I left it out?
AS always thanks for the help!!!!
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there are two ground clusters in that harness as well and i would solder them together while you have it out cause they can give you trouble later on. you'll find the tip sensor in the wire diagram in your book. find the wires to it and track it down to see what he did with it. otherwise jump the pump to see if it works to be sure. there are only a few reasons why the pump wouldn't run with key on. is there a fuse box still? also i believe if the pump won't energize then the inj's won't either depending on the issue. i have heard of some using a resistor to fool the tip sensor to remove it but the simplest way around that is to glue or secure the inside of the sensor all together lol
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Make sure that you have a well charged battery also. You need ,I think ,11.7 volts minimum or it won't fire the plugs.
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Make sure that you have a well charged battery also. You need ,I think ,11.7 volts minimum or it won't fire the plugs.
+1
and also on you pump you prob have 4 wires, two for sender and 1 pos and 1 grnd. check to see if you have voltage there, if not check the universal relay you installed to make sure you didn't get 2 wires crossed by accident. if the relay is right then you should be able to jump it and make the pump work. if you can do that then something is telling the computer to cut power to that relay in which case it either thinks the side stand is down and the bike is in gear or you tip sensor is telling the computer the bike is laid over. or a bad wiring problem beyond that. the motor does crank over doesn't it? depending on year of the motor many have a resistor on 1 wire from the factory switch that reduces voltage back to the computer that turns the computer on. if that isn't right it won't run but depending on how it all got wired the cluster and starter could still work. that's a tough one to tell with out seeing it or especially being the one that dressed the harness.
the tip sensor is a little black box about 2" wide and tall by about 1" thick that has a rubber sleeve over part of it to hang it on the frame. inside is a swinging pendulum so to speak , that breaks contact at certain angles to shut fuel and ignition off if you lay the bike down.
and the diode is a blocking diode so the system doesn't get feedback though the frame i assume. also make sure you install a neutral switch on the clutch, it also acts like a neutral safety switch but if you don't the computer will leave you in a neutral fuel map and never let you hit full rpm's either. the engine will run better if you install the switch and pretty much any switch like a brake switch will work. i use the same brake light switch for that myself on my rail, same as my brake light switch so i know that one works. i could not find on my diagram if there was any kind of resistor or diode in the clutch lever so that is why i used the brake switch.
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+1. Tell us what you may have deleted and how.
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Dont just wire the clutch switch together. Nice write up on MBN about it. It defaults you to a nuetral map, which retards timing and limits rev limiter.
+1 to what other say above.
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Thanks again I found the tip tps sensors both where not correct. I still don't get codes from the dash with jumper installed. Is there a way to check that the ecm is working.
The stock fuse box no longer has anything attached.
The other guy also install a gear readout on the steering wheel it is not working either. Anyone have a wiring diagram for this? Sounds like this may also be part of my problem If the ecm won't start if the car is in gear.
I will have to look into the neutral switch.
I also could use a new connector for the speed healer.
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Aw crap. Sounds like a butchered harness. Enjoy your journey. BTDT. Do you have a correct wiring diagram showing the necessary mods?
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THERE IS SOME INFO YOU MAY NEED IN THIS THREAD. Sorry,cap lock. Anyway, http://www.dtsfab.com/index/index.php?topic=319.0 try here. Next to last post.
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funny thing is that i missed that post or i would've added up the diagrams for zx10 r and 9r as well as r1's and i don't have any of the honda manuals anymore.
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crazyfastfab you'll have to print those off and re-ring your harness. you will need to just pull it out and untape the whole thing and start over cause it sounds like someone has several mistakes. they somehow made it work but it never worked right!
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I will need to print some of those out. I have the service manual and have printed out a 2 x 3 sheet and color coded the lines. Just need to understand what is supposed to happen when so I can trouble shoot what is wrong.
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i had Staples print out at the largest size they could do and laminate the modified one I posted in full color. I HIGHLY recommend it. The large size makes life much easier.
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I will need to print some of those out. I have the service manual and have printed out a 2 x 3 sheet and color coded the lines. Just need to understand what is supposed to happen when so I can trouble shoot what is wrong.
well it sounds like you need to pull the harness and open it all back up and make sure all the lines are connected like the book, the lines you need, lights and horn and flashers don't count unless they piggy backed the ground or pos off one of the lines then you'll need that one and the factory does that a lot so look closely. i bet the guy before you has a few things backwards so imo you would be better off pulling the harness and just matching it all back up to the diagram and change what ever back to follow that needs done.
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ditto.
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if your trying to pull codes then you must have the cluster connected sooooo is the fi light on? does the N light come on when it's in N? if the fi light isn't on you will not get any codes and if the N light isn't on and it is indeed in N then the switch isn't connected or wired properly.
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Thanks for the wiring diagram. I have a plotter so I have printed a couple of D size Plans.
I have been trying to post these pictures all week.
First one is the gear indicator that I need a wiring diagram for. I have emailed the company several times with no response. If anyone knows how to wire it would be nice to know.
Second one is the plug I need.
The last one is what the dash looks like when car is turned on. When power is applied the gauges all go bottom to top and back to bottom.
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We should have asked. I think you have a gen 2 busa. If so ,my diagram is wrong,I think.
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I will have to check at the shop. I figured it out a while back.
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what year is that motor? dash looks like '08 and up and why did that plug get so hot?
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At this point I am pretty sure the engine is an 2008 B-King.
The plug didn't get hot. I was trying to take it a part and the wires came out. I can't seem to take the plug apart with out destroying it to reconnect the wires.
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so did you get it figured out?
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No and I am starting to hate the thing.
I wish I knew what I am doing. I can't find "CHEC" in the manual or internet. I did find that you are supposed to inert the jumper on the diagnostic 4 seconds after powering it up but that didn't help. I keep tracing out wires.
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WHat is the issue again?
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Well it has been a long time coming but today ... Eureka
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_i-xEQ2gG8&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3_i-xEQ2gG8&feature=youtu.be)
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well what was the wiring issue? and your cluster is off a gen II busa.....sounds good
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SO what I have learned.
I tried everything I could on the first harness. I did see it run but for some reason when placed in my car it would not do anything. So I decided to seek professional help. Took the Harness and ECM and sent it to Downs Engineering(CA). They had the harness for over a month and would not start on it. In fairness the guy I bought the engine from had done some really interesting things. I am sure he would be driving along and the car would sputter and or stop and he would have no idea why. I had tried to clean it up but two guys had hacked away at that harness so it was a mess. So I went ahead and ordered another Harness to start over with (I know bone head move). On the up side he did finally start on the harness. I was promised that the harness would come and have three wires to land and the engine would run. I could not figure out how it could be so simple but I liked the sound of that. Well it wasn't. When I got the second harness back from Downs nothing worked at all even less than the first harness.
So now going thru the new harness. Downs did a good job of installing the resistor for the kick stand and removing the tip sensor and cutting out the cooling relay. The harness didn't even have a ground. After landing the B/W wire on a ground and tracing the wires back each of the wires from the harness I found a few more cut wires namely the R/Bl. Once correcting it things started to function. At that point I got the dash to work and display the codes. Once getting the codes I could then chase down the rest of the issues.
What I learned that might be helpful for the next guy.
Orange wire is the ignition wire.
Red wire is the power for the ignition circuit.
Black and Yellow is the starter wire and needs to be grounded when you want the starter to turn. It also tells the ECM to retard the timing during starting. (on the first harness I was trying to power this circuit).
Green yellow is the oil light
Blue is the natural light
Yellow and Blue is the tach.
IF using the stock fuel relay the Yellow and Red is the pump positive and the Black and White wire is ground (throughout the entire harness).
Fuel pump will only operate for three seconds so you might need to turn the car on and off a couple of times to build fuel pressure on initial start. This is not an issue on my car.
Issues I still have other than general cleaning up. C60 Cooling fan relay is on. Not sure how to correct, the manual indicates to go in on the software and turn it off. I don't have the software. The other code is C49 Pair Sensor. I bought the 20 ohm resistor to install on that circuit today. I also have a back feed on the Orange wire of 1 - 4 VDC. I will have trace this out and find the broke component.
I need to clean up the wiring and grease the drive shafts and maybe put the front floor on. Take it for a spin, see what breaks.
Is it good or bad to have a GenII dash?
thanks for the help.
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well if the gen II dash match's the gen II engine there's nothing wrong with it. that's just the later larger busa engine. gen II would be 08 to current and gen I 99-07 i have an 2001. the wire harness's can get interesting but what did that company out of cali have to say when you called them back and told them there harness didn't work at all?
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That company was Downs Engineering? I thought they were one of the gurus . They offer a complete,race ready car sooooo why/how in hell would the harness be so fooked up?
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For that matter,how did you cajole them into messing with your hacked up harness in the first place?
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I just checked their site. $250 to modify YOUR harness??????????
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well if the gen II dash match's the gen II engine there's nothing wrong with it. that's just the later larger busa engine. gen II would be 08 to current and gen I 99-07 i have an 2001. the wire harness's can get interesting but what did that company out of cali have to say when you called them back and told them there harness didn't work at all?
It is a 08 engine some I guess that works.
Downs take for ever to do things but when I did get a hold of them he told me that is worked on the test stand. Not sure how that could have been without a ground attached to the harness.
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That company was Downs Engineering? I thought they were one of the gurus . They offer a complete,race ready car sooooo why/how in hell would the harness be so fooked up?
Ya that is what I thought as well. To make it work I changed things on the harness and now it runs. The biggest thing was the black/white wire was not run the ground and that is the main ground for the harness. I don't know if they some how ground thru a sensor or something but it did not work for me.
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For that matter,how did you cajole them into messing with your hacked up harness in the first place?
He said send your harness to me and I will fix it and send it back to you. But after receiving it he would only tell me that he had a bunch of work in front of me. After sending the new harness it took him a few weeks to get to. He did tell me that the ECM appear to be functioning.
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I just checked their site. $250 to modify YOUR harness??????????
Ya, feel my pain?
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$250 to do the few things he did do is outrageous.
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Ya that is what I thought. Of course he promised everything would be taken care off. He even charges shipping on top of that.
20 ohm resistor cleared up the c49 issue as well so now I am down to c60 but he trimmed the wire so short I can even fake the signal to clear it. Oh well I guess
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well have you drove it yet?
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how far is clovis nm from you?
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Why Clovis, no sand there? It is about 3 hours. I have to go there for work from time to time.
I haven't drove it yet working on cleaning up those last details. Work sure kills my shop time.
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there is a guy in clovis or his addy anyway that bought a used rail. 10 years ago i sold a guy just north of me a chassis with front end and rear end components and he built himself a rail. this guy bought it used and broke the stub axles so i built him a new set of bearing carriers to swap out to the jeep wheel bearings to retain his u joint axles. he is still 4 link and i told him it would be best to convert that to 5 link, easy to do btw. well easy for my maybe not everyone i guess. anyway it's a blue rail of my original design didn't know how close that was and if it was , the closest riding area might be a shared point and you might see him there. now these stubs that he broke or imo just broke, were broke once before and someone did some kind of repair job welding them back together. who knows how long ago or the guy that broke them fixed them and then sold it before it could happen again. the bad part is that those stubs were the last of them from zimmer machine that were being made for short sand car that i bought for my rear ends way back and they were proned to problems on anything over 1000 cc imo. the guy that bought the parts from me 10 years ago was made aware of that but he like the idea of the quadzilla hubs for atv rims. he saw a set laying on a bench and the newer ones which at the time were t1 stubs with 930 flanges were almost done, but he wanted that weak set now!! lol well they lasted longer than i thought they would but that r1 carbed engine prob isn't a power house that he used.
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and the little details take the longest lol hope you can make it for a spring trip to LS
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Well, I would love to see that rail. I always liked your original design. The closest legal place to ride is Mescalero outside of Roswell it would be in the middle for us. It is only a mile square so I don't go there very often. I hope to run into him one of these days.
I thought I would go for a ride to day but the 100 ohm resistor on the Green Black wire broke and I had to go to Albuquerque to buy another one. After fixing that I also cleaned up the mess that was the start circuit and now I don't get the 1 - 4 vdc on that circuit, no thanks to Downs. SO I think All I need to do is mount the ECM and Relays put the floor on and grease the axle and go for a curse. Bummer part is I will be in Texas for the next two weeks.
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Another dumb question what should the oil pressure be? Valvoline 10w-40, 2000 rpm, 61F
The gauge I just installed read 25 - 27 psig.
I finally got to drive it. Went for a little drive around the shop.
Thanks
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They are known to run pretty low at idle. I think you are fine. I run the Mobil1 full syn 20-50 for air cooled v-twins. Don't know the real OP as I just "rely " on the idiot(me) light in the busa dash.
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really not sure myself and i run redline 10w40 for wet clutch's
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Does anyone know how to clear the C60 code? This makes the FI light come on so if anything real turns it on I will never see it. Thanks
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Cooling fan relay; I'm guessing your not using factory relay to turn on fans? Was it done away with in harness mod? I know you can adjust temp and such with software, but not sure about deleting it.
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Ya Downs engineering cut the wire to the ecm and cut out the relay
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Ya Downs engineering cut the wire to the ecm and cut out the relay
Maybe Enemy will pop in, he'd know if it can be wiped with software. He pull most of his hair out learning the Busa Bitch engine. rofl
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Maybe Enemy will pop in, he'd know if it can be wiped with software. He pull most all of his hair out learning the Busa Bitch engine. rofl
;) ;D ;D
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so they not only cut the wires but they unpinned the wires from the connecter? if you have a pin out and an inch or two of wire still at that connector at the computer, you can solder in 2 wires to hook to a relay. have to look at the schematic and see how it was wired. the light and code isn't there because the fan isn't turning on but rather because it isn't seeing the connection I would assume. however I am betting since you have gen2 busa , it may be somewhat diff from our gen 1's
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They just cut the wire right at the connector.
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You'll need to salvage a pin with a short length of wire to fix your issue. No big,big deal.