Chain Heat Testing

[BDKW1]

I don't think airspeed is going to have any effect. Think of how fast the chain is all ready moving through the air to begin with. Without something to physically transfer heat away, I don't see there being any improvement.

[fabr]

I agree. IMO , it all boils down to the TIME needed to cool the heat that is built up each revolution. Too high a speed = too little time. IF a fan EVER really does the job I say GREAT .  But you guys know I'm a skeptic also. Even if you are able to control the heat the friction(lack of adequate lube) that caused it in the first place will still be present and ,if so, so will be the elongation issue. I could be wrong tho.This is getting interesting!

[artie on edge]

Im gonna through my 2 cents in here (even though MY 2 cents isnt worth as much as YOUR 2 cents....)....

No offense but all these OPINIONS dont really mean a lot. Its time someone with a running machine which does have a hot chain conducted a simple experiment. The air blower should be easy, beg borrow steal a heat measuring gun from your local radiator repair shop or use a thermo couple on your multimeter...

Actual facts would be much more enlightening and would save you guys who are defending your opinions a lot of typing time... 

[fabr]

Have you read all of this thread??

[Boostinjdm]

Its time someone with a running machine which does have a hot chain conducted a simple experiment.

Maybe I missed something....Isn't that exactly what Standfast is doing?

[SPEC]

That's a great write up Stands.
And it's really cool to see some actual temperatures, I agree with that the transfer takes time.
But I don't high-volume low pressure would be the answer either, I was dinken around the shop a while back freezing water with blowgun. So there is something to be said for the high-pressure...
Great write up with some good facts

[artie on edge]

Damned if I did..I opened a new thread and it opened at the second page No idea why unless I hovered the cursor at the wrong spot....

I thought i was at the beginning and damn... so no, now I have after discovering the first page... my goof up guys and apologies to Stand.....

[Boostinjdm]

What about directing the air with the direction the chain is moving.  So on top you would be blowing the air forward, and below you would be blowing the air backward.  This would lengthen the time any given volume of air will have contact with that section of chain.

[Hammerworks]

You guys all have way more experience than me,but i just cant see air replacing lubricant when it comes to metal rubbing metal.

Nice job standfast.

Make a quick "case "out of clear plexi(so you can still take the temp readings) and run the test with the chain running in some Amsoil.

[Yoshi]

Hey standfast.  The chain is obviously gonna get hot, you were reading 200 something degrees, is this a bad thing? How do you know that is not within tolerance levels for the chain to be fine?  You know for a fact the drip setup worked, so if you could, can you do the same test with the drip setup, and maybe put some cardboard around the chain so it doesn't make a mess, and see what it is reading?  If it's reading the same temp, then you haven't got the chain hot enough to find out how much cooler it would run with a fan or an oil drip.........

[standfast]

Maybe I missed something....Isn't that exactly what Standfast is doing?

I was gonna say... lol.  a $7000 fluke IR camera aint good enough?  haha

[standfast]

BTW, the gearbox is full to the top gear to keep it lubed during these tests. 

I did some more testing tonight. 

I started by running the car as I always did again at the same speed (60mph).  I let it run for nearly 20 minutes like that.  It peaked around 215 degrees but averaged 210 or so. It doesn't continues to build heat past that point. The article posted by damien suggested that O-rings start to break down at 200 degrees Yoshi.  I wanted to see what it would do past 5 minutes and it didn't seem to climb anymore. 

Next I took the sprocket cover off, put a tab over the end of the clutch pushrod so it wouldn't shoot out and ran it again.  Without the cover on it ran at 190 degrees to my surprise.  Nearly 20 degree difference?  WTF?  Tried it again... same thing.  I am measuring the chain in the same place for consistency on all these tests BTW. 


Next I took a stock busa rad fan and pulled the cage off it so it would push air properly.  I mounted it (rigged it) at the CS sprocket and wired it up.  It pushed a decent amount of air for a small fan.  Ran the test again and it only got to 170 degree average and stabilized there.  Tried it again, same thing!!! Damn this just might work. 

Now I want to add another fan (i have another of the same busa fans) at the rear sprocket to see how much that helps.  Then maybe by some fans will be mountable and build a shroud that is actually ducting the air properly.  This forced air cooling is starting to look up a bit.  I am glad I stuck with it and tried this out.  I was kinda discouraged after the air compressor blower test.  Or possibly try a bilge blower (not sure what will work better). 

Here is some vid of the testing.


Some more cool shots.

Guess which is the masterlink. 

Check out the heat coming out between the link plates.  This was during the test with nothing done. 

Cool shot of the chain bending on the top of the driven sprocket.  If you notice in the video it does this on the bottom side of the drive sprocket too.  Kinda interesting. 

One thing I am a bit concerned about is the fact that the back side of the chain is not getting quite as much cooling.  It is probably much much better than the fan not there but the cooling is probably a bit biased.  Next test with the second fan I will test the other side of the chain if I can get a good view of it and see how it differs. 

[Ozpilot]

The chain doesn't display symptoms of being thrown out by centrifugal force or acceleration or whatever it is. 

Seems there may be advantages in changing something to get the sprocket teeth to let go of the chain as it leaves - but you'd think everybody in the world has already thought about this and the loss in dirve efficency or longivity must outweigh the disadvantages of the present (universally accepted) design.  [so this thought seems stupid - 7 trillion sprocket makers can't be wrong]

I can't help thinking tests under load would be infinitely more helpful - but I don't want to make it seem like I think the tests done here so far are not helpful - at least its got everybody thinking. [so this thought seems fruitless too - it's 5 pm Friday - I think I'll just go and have a drink - even if it at the Friday night in-laws event]

[Yoshi]

Glade your sticking with the test man, I was about to go out and buy a regular laser degree gun, but I was gonna do my test while driving, never thought about doing it in the shop, but I do see a couple variables that are being left out, which may actually mean it will run cooler than what your reading.  The big thing that's being left out right now is complete lack of airflow minus the fan.  When your driving, there will be a lot of wind blowing that will help cool everything that's not being hit with the small fan. 

Something else you may wanna consider (instead of a second fan) is to try doing one of the things I suggested in the beginning, which is to duct air over the chain from a scoop or ram so when your driving, your getting outside air forced into the chain without needing another fan. 

I mentioned in the past I was concerned about the clutch cover blocking air from getting to the front of the chain, and was actually acting like a heat lock, so by running 20 degrees cooler when you removed it, that kinda proved that thought correct.  I actually think it will cool even better if you have a cover with a 4 or 5" fan mounted into it to direct all the air from the fan into that whole cavity, which if built right will also direct air out the back across the top and bottom of the chain where it both enters, and leaves the motor sprocket.  I've almost got the new clutch cover design finished, which for now will be plasma cut outta steel (allowing for the mounting of a small SPAL fan, putting out like 260+ cfm) and then mounted to the motor via spacers.

If your gonna be doing anymore testing, if you could, can you find a big box fan or something, set it back 3 or 4 feet to help represent some airflow as your driving (even though there will be a lot more air as your driving), as well as the small fan up front and see if the little extra airflow helps...

I'm also curious to know how much of a difference the oil drip makes in the same working environment that you've done the fan testing.  If the oil drip doesn't cool any better than what you've already achieved, since you know for a fact the oil drip works in the real world, if you can get the same or better results from current test setup, that would indicate the airflow idea would work as good or better in the real world as well....

[dsrace]

standfast     I have to say thanks for posting all the info and taking the time to run these tests, it really does answer alot of questions!   I can't believe a small busa radiator fan did that much, I would never have guessed that one.  I do still think that going to a 530 chain and larger sprockets and now a small fan as well, will be more than sufficietnt.

enemy I have two of those and a few off of other makes if you want them.