DTSFab.com (Desert, Trail and Sand)

Machinery, Trailers, Toyhaulers and Motorhomes => Trailers, Toyhaulers and Motorhomes => Topic started by: Admin on May 08, 2009, 07:51:52 PM

Title: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 08, 2009, 07:51:52 PM
Ok, I think with all my free time i want to build a 20' trailer, The goal is as light as possible, To carry 3000 lbs... I want to build a Angle Iron trailer, With the 1' side rails for cost and weight... 6.5 x 20' So my biggest question is, the lower rail, Who has a good suggestion on material for the lower rail... I am thinking 4x4 1/4 angle, Or possibly 3" 3/16 channel, then add the rail to give it more strength... Cross members would be i think 2x2 3/16 angle, or maybe 2" channel... All the rail work would be 2x2 3/16... I think, anyone has suggestions or comment please feel free... Tounge would also be 3" 3/16 channel... Or maybe i should go like a 2x4 angle for the tounge, with the 4 down...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: artie on edge on May 08, 2009, 08:00:51 PM
well, given our recent discussions, this would be a good timefor some bright spark to "DESIGN" something.... any takers?

We need stress loads. fatigue points etc... all the numbers please....

 ::)
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 08, 2009, 08:06:45 PM
would a 4" c channel span 20' solo? "no rail" then a 4" c tounge under side, with 2" channel cross member?
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 08, 2009, 09:11:51 PM
It is to scale to :)   

20' x 78"
5" x 6.7 channel perimeter, 4" x 5.4 channel tongue, 2.5x2x3/16 cross members 24" OC..

Frame would weight approximate 603 lbs...

Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Dunebound69 on May 08, 2009, 09:46:15 PM
Bug my 20 foot tilt bed is 6" c- chanel frame. It is an H&H and has a gvw of 12000lbs.  Cross members at 14" centers. I have seen a lot of angle iron trailers out of 2" at about 18' with the side rails.
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 08, 2009, 09:52:00 PM
If i went with a single c channel rail, i think it would be less expensive... What size are your cross members if you get a chance to look...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: trojan on May 09, 2009, 01:20:07 AM
Hey Arite, while you're down there.... :P (for the yanks, the line continues "suck on this")

The "best" single buggy trailer I've seen was made of 1" angle.
I would use the angle for everything (makes a great base - the profile lends itself to the task rather well) and use RHS for the drawbars. and anchor the draw bars PAST the axle(s).... but that maybe just me.
Use 1" "reo" for the floor.
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: artie on edge on May 09, 2009, 04:57:38 AM
Hey Arite, while you're down there.... :P (for the yanks, the line continues "suck on this")

You cant afford me....  8)
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: fabr on May 09, 2009, 09:11:25 AM
Build a real trailer. ;D ;D  Buy this set of plans
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200308239_200308239 (http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200308239_200308239)
use it as a guideline but 2 feet longer. If needed later it should sell well. Just a thought.
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 09, 2009, 09:13:34 AM
Build a real trailer. ;D ;D  Buy this set of plans
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200308239_200308239 (http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200308239_200308239)
use it as a guideline but 2 feet longer. If needed later it should sell well. Just a thought.

You got them plans?
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 09, 2009, 09:14:51 AM
Oh i should add, I got a real trailer now, 6" channel, 3" cross member... it may pull well but seems like it is gonna be heavy...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: fabr on May 09, 2009, 09:16:49 AM
No I bought a set for a gooseneck.Nice set and well detailed.IMO worth the price.Much more reasonable than many plans are! ;D ::) ;D ;D
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Engineer on May 09, 2009, 09:57:28 AM
Only $29 for the plans.  But it is a cadillac compared to what bug wants or needs, and would cost more to build.

What are you thinking of using for flooring bug?  Crossmember spacing and everything else depends on this.

If you go 2" lumber for floor, you can space the crossmembers way out.  if you want 1/16" treadplate then many more crossmembers are required.  What are the other choices?  Marine plywood?

IF you make it the 6.5' wide then you don't have to worry about someone deciding to load their suburban on it.

Also do you want the rails or not?  I think this needs to be a key in deciding between angle and channel.  I would go without the rails personally, then quads could be loaded from the side, and there would be more general flexibility to the trailer.  If no rails then definately go channel.

The loads on the frame of a trailer are kinda screwy.  When your driving something on the back, the load is up on the tounge and front.  Once loaded the bending load reverses from up to down and back again as you proceeded from the tounge to the tail.  The tail is cantilevered past the axles.

For this reversing kind of load I like a suitable channel.  Their are different weights of 4".  I don't have the book in front of me.

What are the laws in you new home state?  Or is it the law of the river?  Have you checked into getting a tag for it.  Here in Kansas there is no tag required for under 2,000 lbs.  I built a car trailer and got it tagged, it was no big deal.  Hi-Po came out and riveted a number plate on it.  They did want to see reciepts for the materials, and the axles specifically.  And he got kind of picky about the clearance light locations, and reflective tape for the sides.

Decide flooring and rail or no rail, and the decisions will get much easier from there.  ;D
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 09, 2009, 10:13:21 AM
I dont care about the rail either way, I care about weight, and cost of course, I think for what i am doing I could do a 5/4 deck... Im not to Certain a angle trailer would cost me less to build than a suitable channel... I havent hauled a car on a trailer in yrs, If i need to so so, i can rent a uhaul for 50.00 Cousin has a car trailer as well that i can use... I am pulling with a 1/2 Chevy Express van, it does have a 350 in it, But its also 850 miles to home when I go, or 1000 to LS if i ever go, So my main concern is weight... Both the prowler and my drak I am gonna say i need a 3k payload, At the same time i dont want the trailer to fatigue from bouncing up and down the road, If i am thinking correctly, a 4" channel at like 5.4 lbs a ft would be suitable... With some light weight cross members...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 09, 2009, 10:14:36 AM
To add, I am confident i can sell the trailer i have, And build the new 20' by mearly adding 200 or so bux to the sale of this one...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Engineer on May 09, 2009, 10:36:06 AM
That sounds good.  5/4 deck, 4" channel sides, 2 x 2 x 3/16" crossmembers on 18" centers.

Are you going to use torflex axles, or spring?

If you are building it specifically for hauling the Drak/Prowler, I would line them up and measure the wheel spacings, and try to put crossmembers directly under where the tires will be setting.  Because of their widths, they will be easy on the crossmembers with the load close to the sides.
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: fabr on May 09, 2009, 10:58:17 AM
Lumber is my field guys.IMO DO NOT use 5/4 decking.The shrinkage and splitting due to the shrinkage will be much greater.Use 2X8's . Should be approx the same cost as 5/4 now and much better. You can easily span 24" and not worry about where the crossmembers are in relation to the load carried.
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Engineer on May 09, 2009, 11:25:30 AM
Lumber man has spoken!  I can't disagree.

My wife believes that I am going to build a deck on our house this year. :P  I was thinking of going 2" instead of the 5/4 for the same reason's.  Mainly I don't want any spring in it.  I wanted to go with the composites, but just looking at it on the rack, it bows very easily, and for the cost, I can't see that it would be worth it.  What do you recomend Fabr?
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: trojan on May 09, 2009, 12:34:08 PM
I would have thought 2x8 'lumber' would make it rather heavy?
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: SPEC on May 09, 2009, 12:44:29 PM
2X8 dimension lumber seems to be the "norm" for trailer decking around here to...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 09, 2009, 02:02:28 PM
fabber what is the weight diff per ft on average? 2 x 8 16 treated are 12.00 5/5 likely is a bunch higher... I was mearly thinking weight...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 09, 2009, 02:04:19 PM
That sounds good.  5/4 deck, 4" channel sides, 2 x 2 x 3/16" crossmembers on 18" centers.

Are you going to use torflex axles, or spring?

If you are building it specifically for hauling the Drak/Prowler, I would line them up and measure the wheel spacings, and try to put crossmembers directly under where the tires will be setting.  Because of their widths, they will be easy on the crossmembers with the load close to the sides.

Springs, Hung right to the underside of the 4 ", I am thinking to put the c out as well, Easier to weld cross members in, And a different look...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 09, 2009, 02:05:32 PM
What about using angle, 4x2 bottom, and 2x2 top rail? i may compare the price differences...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Engineer on May 09, 2009, 03:40:14 PM
I like not needing the rail for strength, and as an added bonus better access.

The weight of the 2x8 will be offset by needing less crossmembers.
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 09, 2009, 03:49:18 PM
so you think a 4" channel will be sufficent hanging 20'? And 2 x 2 cross members, then 4" channel for the tounge as well...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 09, 2009, 03:55:08 PM
Im not dovetailing it either, I will have a 4' gate that folds in the center so upright it is 2' Shouldnt drag to badly, I will build the gate out of 1x2 tubing standing 2up and then cap the rear with a 2x2 angle... so it flushes better with the ground... Should be cake to build that way, Ill have the steel supplier cut all the cross members to length, Front and rear rails ill put the c in, and the side rails ill put it out, No 45 cuts that way either...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: fabr on May 09, 2009, 05:08:05 PM
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Dunebound69 on May 11, 2009, 02:21:10 PM
Bug my cross members are 4" the thing is heavy. Tows good just over kill for buggies.
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 11, 2009, 02:52:04 PM
I am half tempted to go 2x3 angle for the lower rail and 2 x 2 angle cross members, then a 2 x 2 perimeter rail with a 4" c tounge...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Engineer on May 11, 2009, 04:45:34 PM
Did you price the 4" channel?

Do you still have the bandsaw?

Need to kind of figure the deck heigth with the wheels/tires/springs/axles that you plan to use, and see if it makes sense for the tounge to run under the  trailer deck, or to join in at the same elevation as the side rails.

Can you do a drop axle with the axle's/springs that you are looking at?

I am kind of partial to a low trailer deck for easy loading and unloading, and not having the cargo above the truck top.  Probably won't be a problem with you van but you might look at how tall it will be if the deck ends up being 20" high.  I don't mind dragging the ass now and then in order to get a lower heigth.  With no dove it really won't be a problem dragging anyway.
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 11, 2009, 05:10:23 PM
4" c 5.4 - 99.36 per 20'
2x2x3/16 - 45.88 per 20
2x3x3/16 - 57.72 per 20
3" c x 4.1- 75.44 per 20

3.00 per cut on the 4" c, 2.50 on angle...

I definitely will dovetail it. drop axles are a bunch more money, i was thinking yesterday 20' treated lumber is hard to come by, so dovetailing 4' will work great for lumber...

I do have the band saw still yes..
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: fabr on May 11, 2009, 05:25:18 PM
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: Admin on May 11, 2009, 05:26:22 PM
You stock 20' treated 2 x 8's? I have often seen 20' untreated lumber...
Title: Re: Trailer Building
Post by: fabr on May 12, 2009, 10:52:50 AM
I stock 60-100 at all times in treated .   You need to start going to REAL lumber yards.I keep ALL lengths of 2x4 through 2x12's from 8-20' both treated and untreated #2 only.No utility or low grade stuff here. BTW,(OZZIES LOL!)#2 grade is the normal best grade of lumber for framing purposes.Don't let the #2 mislead you.. Longer lengths are here 3 times a week. Yep ,Bug,you shoulda moved to Kansas .