RC51 powered "rhino"

[RC51 Rhino]

 Got my carrier done...most of the way. Do I need any bracing on the caliper bracket? Just need to get the mount done on the frame and build/buy my adjusters, and of course fab up my drive shafts and stuff. My sprockets should be here on the 3rd (thanks Rick!). It's finally coming together!

[Admin]

As long as it is from the attachment poiunt, I would Definitley brace it, and do so as high as possible, them calipers have ungodly force, Mine was bent and it is a angle bracket, it bent the tube and all that it is attached to...

[RC51 Rhino]

 Sounds like a plan to me. I sent Rick S. an email to order up some more parts for the rear end. Namely some plates to be water jet cut to make up the drive flanges on the ends of the axle.

  I would like some input on the front of my car if you all would. I have everything in paralell right now and believe that since I must redo my a-arms to widen the front to better fit the rear, I might as well do some better work on my camber gain and shock location. If I were to move my top a-arm mounts closer together, would this help in giving me some camber gain? How much should I look for? I think the rear is at about 1* static and gains 2* more at bump. Should I look to get the same or close on the front?

 I'll post some pics of the front tomorrow. I'm coming down o the end of this build...FINALLY, and can't wait to drive it!

[artie on edge]

  I would like some input on the front of my car if you all would. I have everything in paralell right now and believe that since I must redo my a-arms to widen the front to better fit the rear, I might as well do some better work on my camber gain and shock location. If I were to move my top a-arm mounts closer together, would this help in giving me some camber gain? How much should I look for? I think the rear is at about 1* static and gains 2* more at bump. Should I look to get the same or close on the front?

Howdy Rhino, have a look at this site for modelling up your suspension. I found it invaluable when doing my rear, havet yet had a go with the front. Should be ok for camber gain calcs.

http://www.racingaspirations.com/suspensiongeometry.php

[Engineer]

  I would like some input on the front of my car if you all would. I have everything in paralell right now and believe that since I must redo my a-arms to widen the front to better fit the rear, I might as well do some better work on my camber gain and shock location. If I were to move my top a-arm mounts closer together, would this help in giving me some camber gain? How much should I look for? I think the rear is at about 1* static and gains 2* more at bump. Should I look to get the same or close on the front?

If you added some KPI to the spindles, it would also create some camber gain.  You need the top arm to get shorter to get what you are looking for.  KPI does this as well as moving the top mounts further apart.  Moving closer together will hurt the cause.

Moving the frame mounts closer together vertically can also get you some camber gain in compression, but can result in camber change the wrong way in droop.

Give us some dimensions for the components and we could draw something that might help.  It might be just as easy to modify the spindles as the frame.  Are you planning to run front brakes?

The link Artie gave works well once you get you head around the MM conversion, and how it works.

[RC51 Rhino]

 I know I need my steering arms in double shear...no need in pointing that out. My parts measure out as such:
  A-arms are 22" and need to be re-built 7" or so wider to match the rear width.
  Verticle spread is 8" both frame and spindle.
  Horizontal spread at the frame is 8.25"
 
 I thought KPI was the angle top to bottom leaning back, not in? Castor, not camber? I have some set in KPI if that is what it is called, you can see it the first pic.

 I am planning on rebuilding alot of the front end anyway, so any ideas right now can be incoperated! Pitch away!






 

[plkracer]

You need more kpi. The line through the 2 joints is barely touching the inside edge of the tire. Also, the vertical spread at the upright should be MORE than the vertical spread at the frame, or you will get positive camber gain as the suspension compresses.

[artie on edge]

KPI is King Pin Inclination. A line drawn through the upper and lower pivot (when viewed from the front) should hit the ground approx 1/2 inch inside the tyres centreline, or there abouts, some say a little more.

KPI is also, more accurately IMO, known as SAI or Steering Axis Inclination, it depends upon which book you.

[Engineer]

Ok, First pic is sorta what you have.  I don't have the correct shock mount numbers etc.  I stretched the width a total of 7".  Keep in mind I don't know the spindle width and tire arrangement, I just guessed off of the pictures.  The red line is the KPI.






Second picture, I changed the KPI to 1/2" inside the center of the tire.  I also increased the separation on the spindle to 10".  You can see on the right side how you get camber gain in compression and droop.  On the left side is the same thing at ride height with 0 Camber.  You will need to keep the caster (top heim behind the lower heim on the spindle) when building the arms.  I also think that you could benefit by moving the shock out where I showed on this drawing, to pick up some ratio.  It might cost just a bit of travel, but the 22" is quite a bit.





Hmmm for some reason drawings look like crap.  GTG now.

[artie on edge]

What Eng said +1 ... no plus +47,567

Good work Eng.. extremely clear mate.

[Admin]

Get someone to cad you up some new uprights and have rick s water jet them as well...

[RC51 Rhino]

 Sounds like a good plan. I was looking into cutting the whole front end off tonight...by the looks of the drawings (thanks Engineer!) maybe that's a bit extreme? I need to look into some new spindle material to be able to use my hubs on a new set of uprights. Anybody got a free minute to
'cad-up' a new set of uprights? I don't have a cad program nor the ability to use one...what would something like that be worth anyway?

[Engineer]

Need some more dimensions.... shock locations, spindle info, desired track width at ride height, etc.  Can you salvage the spindle stubs?  What diameter are they?  No front brakes?

[RC51 Rhino]

 I'll have to start at the beginning one night this week. I need to set the car at ride height and measure everything up. I'm not sure if I want to salvage the snouts...they have been welded on a LOT!! They are EZGO spindles and are approx. 1" in dia. I like the hubs as they are easy to get and come in welded steel or cast aluminum. I can always get someone to make me a set out of billet, too. I'm torn on the brake thing. I've never touched my front brakes on my quad at the dunes and all the 4x4s I've had would throw me through the windshield if I hit the brakes hard in the sand...how do I get around that? Suppose I could go with a porportioning valve and maybe turn the fronts way down or off in the sand?

[Punkur67]

Should be ok with just rear brakes as long as they are good ones. I ran a single inboard disk on my full size streetbike powered car and it stopped just fine. But all 4 corners is beter if you can do it.