Slow Build by Engineer

[dsrace]

the bearing in the pic is off of an 97 cherokee and I cut another old one up last night that was off of an 84 cherokee I believe. I would have to go check to be sure but it also was tappered and said timken on it.  the ones on my rail currently were in a timken box but the fact still remains that rim flex won't push pistons in my caliper. I am tq'd to 250 and seems to have taken 95 -98 % of the problem out so next time out I am going to tq to 300! my rim is 2 piece aluminum cws and 3/4" thick throught he pilot hole they did weld the center together and bolt the upper halfs together which would also lead me to believe they know they have issues! I would pre fer centerlines like enemy's. mine probably only flexed 1/8" total at the 180 ft lb tq that the box said to tq to. I would just be careful or atleast have a back up plan if this doesn't work!

[dsrace]

engineer or live wire let me ask you this what is the bearing pilot hole dia of the f150 wheel bearing? or in other words the hole dia of that wheel bearing where it goes through and bolts to you carrier?

what are some thoughts on this one? the jeeps are juat about 4" od  and the impalas are 3.59". I don't know the f150 but if the bearings were larger od wouldn't that be better and maybey even less chance of flex or am I thinking about this backwards.  thats if these are tappered ones.

[LiveWire]

Engineer can probably answer the size since he has already done CAD work. I know they are larger than the Impala bearing flange. Larger would give more leverage.

[Engineer]

Here are the sizes:

Front Wheel Bolt Quantity=5
Flange Dia=7.226"
Bolt Circle Dia=5.316"
Wheel Pilot Dia=3.415"
Brake Pilot Dia=3.542"
Flange Offset=1.94"
Hub Pilot Dia=3.91"
Splines=33
Flange Shape=TRIANGULAR Hub Assembly

It's all pretty clear, the flange offset is the distance from the mounting face of the brake rotor to the mounting face of the bearing into the spindle/carrier.

[Engineer]

Here are some drawings that have been hanging out in Autocad for a year.  I don't really like the roof lines, but haven't played with them much.
 


I am going forward with this design.  50 parts ready to go to laser.  Just need to finish up the 5-link carriers at the wheels and order the parts.  The center bearing mount design is done.  It isn't going to flex, but I don't even want to calculate the weight.

[Doug Heim]

wow! looks like some serious clearance!

I just finished up your custom HMS's tonight. You will be very happy!

[Yummi]

Diggin the realism - flat biller with a ponch?

[Engineer]

Diggin the realism - flat biller with a ponch?

What's the point if you can't be real?  I was having fun with the drawing....  Didn't take you long to spot that!  I'm not cool enough for the hat or the Oakleys, but the ponch I do pretty well.  :P

wow! looks like some serious clearance!

I just finished up your custom HMS's tonight. You will be very happy!

Thanks Doug!  That was quick.  Got me out of a pinch there.  Now I won't have to make dummy spacers to weld up the spindles. 

Hoping to get this project moving!

[SPEC]

 
HE HE HE HE
GIGGLE GIGGLE GIGGLE
Yumster sometimes you fooken kill me

[Engineer]

New roof

[Yummi]

Dude,

I am so not as smart as you. 

Having said that, i am not digging some of the bar placement - blue = concerns.  Red = suggested?  Hard to find a nice work around on the front bars tieing into the floor.

Looks like the load path on the rear upright would want to collapse? 

BTW - like the shock braces.

[Engineer]

Dude,

I am so not as smart as you. 

Having said that, i am not digging some of the bar placement - blue = concerns.  Red = suggested?  Hard to find a nice work around on the front bars tieing into the floor.

Looks like the load path on the rear upright would want to collapse? 

BTW - like the shock braces.

Yummi

Your smarter....  Everyones strengths are different.  You can see the gray areas.

Thanks for the input.  I have been tinkering with this for about a year and I may have a forest/tree issue. 

The front blue circle, I have no excuse..... 

My plan is to use 1.5 x .120 tubing for most everything shown now.  I consider this main structure.  I bought some 1.5 x .083 and 1.25 x .083 for secondary gusseting.  I don't think there should be much secondary needed which is why I choose the bigger tube for the primary.  I am not to big a fan of spaghetti frame.

The red line shows my reasoning on the front.  If you look at the top view, the frame is going to turn inward right where that vertical tube is.  I am trying to isolate the loads and keep them in line so that the flat side of the car has its trusses right up to the corner, then the frame turns and the trusses in front of the corner are in line.  It really bugs me to not have a side to side crossmember at that bottom corner on the floor, but I don't think your feet would appreciate one there and the floor will provide some support.

Once again I am bucking the norm with the lower frame rail tube which most people form a hoop around the bottom of the car and go across to the opposite side.  It will be harder to build, but mine turns up and ties in right to the front bulkhead / shock mount which is the load that the truss frame of the side is supposed to be carrying.    It will also make the side panels flow very well IMO.

As to where the tube should land when supporting a bent tube....  Your forward red line.  I don't know.  I wanted to keep the side to side crossmember flush to the bottom in order to make it easier to mount the floorpan then ran the gusset tube to that point.  It probably would be stronger hitting the center of the bend.  I changed it and it looks better.  Next post will reflect it.  Thanks!

Moving back....  I see your concerns in red.  Lots of variables to juggle.  I made another drawing to play with some options.  Landing the B pillar at the shoulder or at the rear point (your blue circle) would be strong enough IMO.  The rear shocks are holding it all up, the B pillar is transfering the load down holding the main weight, occupants and motor.  Your location makes more sense being in line with the weight.

On the flip side, I can't move the crossmember right behind the seat back or it will get into the motor.  Would it matter if the B pillar and the frame trussing all landed 4-6" behind the crossmember?  That would raise complaints as well.  The other problem is my upper shock mount.  If anything it should move back.  I didn't draw enough before buying the 18" stroke shocks.  The further forward the upper mount moves the more the shock lays down and the more travel it generates.  I am already over 20" travel which is fine, but laying it over more messes with the progressive curve / perpendicular at full bump crap.   :-\

Could go for the get both option and have an A, B, C and D pillar  but we are talking about a 1500 lb car here.  I have seen lots of cars with 2 pillars, and V-8 cars with 3.

Plus the shock brace doesn't work as well with forward B pillar. 

Second picture I moved the rear vertical tube to the center of the bend at the bottom of the frame.  I like it from a structure and strength standpoint, but that tube was also going to be the mounting for the firewall between engine / occupants and the firewall probably won't work that far back so then do I end up with a dead dummy tube later to hold the firewall....

[Engineer]

Moved the lower crossmember in front of the engine forward 4" which fixed the firewall problem, and lengthened the 5-link bars some improving on some other issues. 

I think all of the frame gusseting is changing to .083 wall tube with only the top bottom and roof bars being .120.

Added some of the roof bars in the top view.....   I can see why people like 3D, I can't even tell what is what in the jumble.

Thanks for getting me off center Yummi.  Made lots of improvements.  Better now than with a grinder and cutoff wheel later.

[fabr]

Moved the lower crossmember in front of the engine forward 4" which fixed the firewall problem, and lengthened the 5-link bars some improving on some other issues. 

I think all of the frame gusseting is changing to .083 wall tube with only the top bottom and roof bars being .120.

Added some of the roof bars in the top view.....  I can see why people like 3D, I can't even tell what is what in the jumble.

Thanks for getting me off center Yummi.  Made lots of improvements.  Better now than with a grinder and cutoff wheel later.

YUP!!!!!

[Engineer]

YUP!!!!!

Wanna draw it for me so I will know what it will look like? 

Don't worry I will have a SOLID model soon.